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Fat Ass, Blue Mts, 1 July 06...


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#1 Mister G

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 02:41 AM

This post has been edited for clarity....

Comrades,

On Saturday 1 July I'll be staging a Fat Ass run with a 100K long option in the Blue Mts.

LONG COURSE WILL BE

Start: Queen Victoria Hospital (Tableland Rd, Wentworth Falls)- Kedumba- Solitary Pass- Little Cedar Pass- Narrowneck- Valley Rd- Medlow Bath (via Cooper/West/Fitzgerald Sts and Railway Crescent)- Grand Canyon Rd- Grand Canyon- Evans Lookout- Govetts Leap, Blackheath- Pulpit Rock- Perrys Lookdown- Blue Gum Forest- Burra Korain Flat- Victoria Falls- Mt Victoria- One Tree Hill (highest point in the Blue Mts, at Mount Victoria)- Berghofers Pass- Lockyers Track- Hartley Vale- Browns Gap- Hassans Walls- Queen Elizabeth Park, Lithgow.

Recommended 1:25 000 topo maps: Katoomba, Jamison, Jenolan, Hartley, Hampton, Mt Wilson, Lithgow.

Possible short options-

Queen Vic- Packsaddlers (37K)
Queen Vic- Explorers Tree (54K)
Queen Vic- Blackheath/ Mt Vic (62K/ 80K)
Explorers Tree- Lithgow (50K)

Water/aid- water is available at from tanks or taps at Packsaddlers, Medlow Bath, Blackheath, Mt Vic, Hartley Vale. I drank from Cedar Creek (on the Queen Vic- Packsaddlers leg) last Saturday with no ill effects- this will be the longest stretch without external aid. There will probably be a roving aid crew (if you run at my pace....)

Tentative start time- 7am.

Confirmed starters (last updated 28/6/06)

Mister G
Virtual
Herrmannator
Sleepy

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#2 tim

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 04:16 AM

July is open for me.

#3 Mister G

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 05:19 AM

... for K-M?

#4 tim

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 05:43 AM

why not.

#5 Whippet Man

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 05:44 AM

Sorry G, count me out. I'm planning a little fatass run down here for the locals in the middle of july so won't be up. I think I will have exhausted my credits by then anyhow.  ;)

#6 tim

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 06:12 AM

so the way I see it if we add the K-M to July it all comes together nicely.

Jun  - PMC
July - K-M
Aug  - 12 Foot
Sep  - Glasshouse
Oct  - Blue Lab
Nov  - Great North 100
Dec  - C2K
Jan  - Bogong

anyone thinking of doing all the above?

#7 Whippet Man

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 06:24 AM

quote:


anyone thinking of doing all the above?

You mean besides you?

#8 Mister G

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 06:28 AM

I'll be passing on any October ultra in favour of the World Rogaine Champs.

(Who wants to partner me?)

Be interesting to be running down along the Wollondilly on a night like tonight- windchill is below zero here at the moment, with drizzle... Mittagong is pretty much the same.

#9 tim

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 06:34 AM

quote:


Originally posted by Whippet Man:
You mean besides you?

I have not even started the process of building up home credits so it is all just a dream at the moment.  

But when you think about it each run is merely a training run for the following one.

#10 Spud

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 01:23 PM

quote:


But when you think about it each run is merely a training run for the following one.
  

Yeah, all leading up to B2H   :P  

I'm interested G, if not K-M then 100k in the Blue Mountains as you've suggested, I'm sure you've got some ideas living up there now. My leave passes are truly limited so no GC100 this year, need something else to fill in July, and fatass sounds good.

Cheers

#11 tim

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 03:10 PM

I got an email the other day suggesting we get T-shirts with

(_!_)

on them.


and Spud we all know Bogong would be a cool down run  to just loosen the legs up  :D

#12 Dazza K

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 03:17 PM

Aunty and I have definitely been talking to Eagle too much and been affected by dinner with Virtual, too many dinners with Blue Dog and too much time talking at SFT with Mr G.  Looks like my plan for the year will now become more concrete.  I have spoken to a few people about what I would like to do this year so the plan is really growing and I guess now is as good a time as any to put it out there.  As it now stands:

Races by month
May: SMH Half
Jun: Kempsey marathon and PMC
Jul: GCM (ADF Championships)and K-M
Aug: Yeppoon 1/2 IM(same weekend as 12 Foot Track)
Sep: Glasshouse

Oh god, what am I getting myself in for?  :)  

Then god knows.  December I am support crew for someone over at Busselton and will be doing an ultra drive to get there and back.  Gotta love long service leave!

Cheers!

#13 Yurtie

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 06:21 PM

Mr G,

have you ever done Lithgow to Newnes or run around the Glow Worm Tunnel area?

#14 Paul Every

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 06:31 PM

Sean - I'll be keen for a lengthy route in the Blue Mountains...

#15 Rudolf

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 06:38 PM

quote:


Originally posted by Whippet Man:
  I'm planning a little fatass run down here for the locals in the middle of july

can You spill out the beans, please ?

#16 tim

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 06:48 PM

quote:


Originally posted by Rudolf:
can You spill out the beans, please ?

Ironbark 45km

#17 Mister G

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 07:08 PM

Yurtie,

Sorry I missed you yesterday, how was it?

I think you and I have discussed this this route before, but would you mind putting some details up here so everyone can read it and think about it?

#18 Speedy Gonzalez

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 07:41 PM

MrG,Yurtie

We have been up to the glow worm tunnel a few times from the ZigZag railway turnoff near Clarence. From memory, the tunnel is a good30-40kms from the Bell Rd, and Newnes is around 2hr walk from the tunnel. The dirt rds do not have much traffic on them, and the potholes are mainly responsible for the sorry state of my shocks. The tunnel is about 2-300m long, so a torch is needed.

In future, the only glow worm trip my car is making is to glow worm glen in bundanoon.

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Posted 08 May 2006 - 07:46 PM

Mr G. with considerable trepidation I announce my interest.  A few other possibilities could be: Kanangra Walls to Katoomba, Wentworth Falls to Waragamba Dam.

It really is time I found out if I have what it takes to be a real trail runner.

#20 Mister G

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Posted 09 May 2006 - 05:36 AM

Toying with the idea of making it Mittagong-Katoomba rather than the other direction. Purely selfish reasons really... I've not done it in that direction, and I like the idea of "running home" finishing 3K from my front door. I'll put a few of you lot up at my place afterwards if we do it this way.

I also think the climb from the Coxs River up to Narrowneck after +100km will be really horrible.

Quick warning for the uninitiated- if we do M-K (or K-M) it will involve around 24 hours, running +130K, almost entirely self supported. There is one access point, at Yerranderie, and there will probably be a support vehicle there. But in general, you'll be carrying all the food and gear required for an overnight winter mountain run.

Kanangra, you know I have huge respect for the way you go about things, and it'd be an honour to have you there. When you say "Wentworth Falls to Warragamba Dam" are you referring to following the Watershed FT off near McMahon's Lookout and taking that down to the dam wall? That's around 80Kish, but I'm not sure if the authorities allow public access to the dam itself anymore...?

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Posted 09 May 2006 - 02:48 PM

Mr G Yes I was referring to the Watershed Track. If access cannot be gained to Waragamba Dam then there is a better way. You take a left near the end on what is known as the Jack Evans Track. This takes you down steeply to Erskine Ck. I think it is. Then up the other side you pick up a dirt road which joins up with the Woodford to Glenbrook Rd. This you then follow out to Glenbrook or if you like back up to Woodford?

I've not done it for a few years but I took a bike through. Had to carry it down the JE Track though.

#22 tim

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Posted 09 May 2006 - 03:39 PM

hey G didn't the M - K route take Paul and Jan 30+ hours?

#23 Spud

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Posted 09 May 2006 - 04:17 PM

36 hrs I believe!

#24 Yurtie

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Posted 09 May 2006 - 05:05 PM

There is another track that heads down to the dam from Hayes Crossing below Narrowneck. It only goes to the water level though, not to the dam wall. I imagine it's fairly overgrown.

Wemtworth Falls to Blackheath via Medlow Gap is about 65k if you do the last bit on Megalong Rd. An alternative would be to return up the Six Foot Track.

With regards to Newnes, I have been out there many times. I originally floated the idea of an off road marathon from Lake Wallace to Lithgow via Blackfellow's Hands Cave Rd. That is bang on 42k to Marjorie Jackson oval.

There are many many tracks on Newnes Plateau. Some of them are old shale mine railways and as such are fairly well graded. An interesting run would be from The Glow Worm Tunnel to Newnes and then on to Glen Davis.

Sean, I think you'd better bring some beers over and we'll get the maps out.

#25 Mister G

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Posted 11 May 2006 - 01:23 AM

Yeah, M-K did take Paul and Jan 36 hours, however they went over Belloon Pass, not Wombeyan Caves Rd- Mt Wanganderry (which is what I have in mind) and they made a couple of navigation errors, one of which cost them several hours from memory.

Yurtie, will give you a buzz....

#26 Hermie

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Posted 11 May 2006 - 01:55 AM

Hmmmmmmm

A week after GCM and a week before Kokoda Challenge.

What to choose?

Or a trifecta?

#27 Mister G

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Posted 11 May 2006 - 07:23 PM

Actually, as Mr Tiller and a few others know, a few years ago I devised a 100 mile course which went Wentworth Falls- Kings Tableland- Watershed Trail- Warragamba Dam picnic grounds (cross the dam wall)- Jack Evans Track (cross over the dam again)- Glenbrook- reverse. A couple of dudes did the route on MTBs and it was pretty close to the mark, maybe a few km short each way.

Only problem we foresaw was that runners would have to carry their own stuff for 30Kish at a time- we envisaged aid on Kings Tableland, at Warragamba and Glenbrook, plus drinking out of Ripple Creek on the Watershed trail.

I think dam access was shut off not long after- spillway construction work, I think- and then security kept it closed thereafter.

Anyone know if the public can cross Warragamba Dam wall these days...?

#28 Mister G

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Posted 19 May 2006 - 05:51 AM

Bump.

I'm shifting this to the first weekend of July (1st- 2nd) as I'll be away the following weekend.

I'd like people to think about this course Yurtie came up with and which I've tweaked a bit, which he is pretty confident is 100 miles, with a few bail out points along the way for those wanting to go short. Sort of Blue Labyrinth on steroids...

Katoomba Park- Federal Pass- Golden Stairs- road to Explorers Tree- 6FT to Coxs River- Mt Tinpot- Medlow Gap- Kedumba Walls- Ingar FT- Woodford- Andersons FT- Kedumba Walls- Mt Solitary- Golden Stairs- Katoomba Park.

Almost all MTBable, except Mt Solitary and a couple of points on Federal Pass, so therefore pretty runnable. Main problem I see is that there's not much drinkable water on this course- we'd have to put some water drops out I suppose.

Thoughts...?

#29 tim

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Posted 19 May 2006 - 03:49 PM

yeah I am out I will be on the Gold Coast.  Bugger!

#30 Diane

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Posted 19 May 2006 - 03:49 PM

Sean, Paul is working that weekend.  Failing the 8/9 July, Paul's off again on 22/23 July...

#31 Dazza K

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Posted 19 May 2006 - 04:58 PM

quote:


Originally posted by tim:
yeah I am out I will be on the Gold Coast.  Bugger!

Ditto, looks like another long run later on.  Maybe I'll do something out Katoomba way before everybody else this year.  ;)    I'll be up Yeppoon way when it's on by the calendar.

Cheers!

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Posted 19 May 2006 - 06:27 PM

First weekend in July is out for me I'm afraid. Would prefer the classic K-to-M or M-to-K.

#33 tim

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Posted 19 May 2006 - 06:35 PM

so who is up for a run on the 8 - 9 July?

Sean if you could mark out the track on your run we could follow your markings the following week.

#34 Virtual

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Posted 22 May 2006 - 03:49 AM

New date works better for me..  Just a tentative interest at this point..  Brendan

#35 Mister G

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 04:32 AM

Okay, I've been kicking around thoughts on a 100 mile route traversing the Blue Mountains, Nepean River to Lithgow, for a few weeks- in the footsteps of Blaxland, Lawson and Wentworth. Been doing some number crunching with bushwalking guidebooks, MTB websites and Gmaps-Pedometer and come up with a tentative 167km for the following route...

Emu Plains- Mitchells Pass- Glenbrook- Oaks Fire Trail- Woodford- Andersons FT- Tableland Rd- Queen Vic Hospital- Kedumba- Solitary Pass- Medlow Gap- Packsaddlers- Old Ford Reserve (via Megalong Valley Rd)- Explorers Tree (via 6FT)- Blackheath (via Medlow Bath and Railway St/ Station St)- Shipley- Kanimbla Drive- Little Zig Zag Trail- One Tree Hill (highest point in the Blue Mts, at Mount Victoria)- Berghofers Pass- Lockyers Track- Hartley Vale- Browns Gap- Hassans Walls- Majorie Jackson Reserve, Lithgow.

Yesterday I measured the section from Queen Vic to Packsaddlers with the GPS, so the July Fat Ass will cover a long stretch of this course, and we'll measure it as we go.

Next year, we'll run the full 100 miles!

#36 Virtual

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Posted 29 May 2006 - 04:33 AM

Well there's the Grand Slam!

edit: woops didn't mean to take you to the next page. readers are advised to go back to p1 and read G''s comment for context.

#37 Virtual

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Posted 31 May 2006 - 08:36 AM

Stop Press: Looks like July 1/2 or 8/9 is good for me..  Bring it on Sean.

#38 Mister G

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Posted 01 June 2006 - 06:49 AM

I have now edited the first post of this thread to reflect the final details of the July run.

Apologies for any confusion caused by my public musing, it's the way I think. Long option is now a 100Kish run from the Queen Vic Hospital to Lithgow on Saturday July 1.

#39 Spud

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Posted 01 June 2006 - 03:30 PM

This looks great Sean, must admit (selfishly) would prefer somewhere more in the "middle " between PMC and 12FT
say mid July but I'm a likely starter.

#40 Mister G

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Posted 02 June 2006 - 04:01 AM

If anyone's interested in joining me, I'll be running over the last ~50K of this course, from Explorer's Tree to Lithgow, on Sunday morning.

Yeah, sorry about the change of date, but I have something else on every weekend of July- either work, study or another event.

List updated...

#41 Sleepy

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Posted 20 June 2006 - 10:30 PM

Hi Mister G

I assume that the run is still on for the 1st July.  Am looking forward to joining you for it. Are you planning to post the sketch map of the course?

Happy trails

Sleepy

#42 Mister G

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Posted 20 June 2006 - 11:07 PM

Sketch map coming soon Sleepy, I've tweaked the course a bit also.

Are you planning on running the full 100K?

#43 Sleepy

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 03:59 PM

Hi

Yes I do want to do the complete course. How long do you expect to take to do the full course?

Cheers

Sleepy

#44 Mister G

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 04:10 PM

At least 14-15 hours, if not more- you'll certainly need night gear (headlamps etc) and cold/wet weather gear. Have you run in the bush at night before?

There will be a support crew who can ferry gear around.

Edited by Mister G, 22 June 2006 - 04:18 PM.


#45 Sleepy

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 10:00 PM

Hi

Yes that is about the time that I thought. Yes I have done a fair bit of both bush and night running. Looking forward to the challenge of the cold and the wet though.  ANother question, do I need the maps or will the sketch be enough.

I am quite experienced with map and compass navigation (10 years in the army will do that to a chap.) so if we need the maps that will be fine.

S

#46 Mister G

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Posted 22 June 2006 - 11:13 PM

View PostSleepy, on Jun 22 2006, 10:00 PM, said:

ANother question, do I need the maps or will the sketch be enough.

The topo maps would be a good idea. My digital camera has gone (temporarily I hope) AWOL so I can't post the images of the maps on here.

#47 Sleepy

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Posted 27 June 2006 - 10:30 PM

Hey Mr G, on Sunday at the race you mentioned that you have changed the course a bit and that you would release the new details. Can you please let me know what the changes are as I need to mark up my maps organise my support stops.
Thanks
Much appreciated

S

#48 Mister G

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Posted 28 June 2006 - 12:04 AM

Revised course description is online.

Haven't finished the sketch map yet, but will be finished tomorrow.

Katoomba forecast for Saturday- showers and 3- 12 degrees. Pack the goretex, lads.

#49 Virtual

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Posted 28 June 2006 - 08:36 AM

View PostSleepy, on Jun 22 2006, 06:00 AM, said:

I am quite experienced with map and compass navigation (10 years in the army will do that to a chap.) so if we need the maps that will be fine.

I'll be there.  Good thing you can use a compass Sleepy.  I'm "directionally challenged" so I'll need to try to stay close to you or Sean.  I'll be packing the beanie and gloves.  Brendan

#50 Virtual

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Posted 03 July 2006 - 11:32 PM

All,

Wasn’t sure if I wanted to put up a race report for this one but the quad aches have subsided a bit so here goes.

Arrived at Mr G and Skizzik’s on Friday night and tucked into some Chinese take away. After lots of discussion about ultimate challenges I crashed.

I wasn’t too nervous about the run because I’ve been training well, lost a couple of kilos and I knew that I’d be ok so long as I stayed with either Hermannator, Sleepy or Mr G as they all had local knowledge or excellent map reading skills.

Awoke early and had my porridge then Skizzik took us to the start at the Wentworth Falls hospital. After a bit of standing around comparing Hydration packs, gloves and beanies in the freezing cold we decided to set off at 07:30.

I was probably a bit overweight by carrying a 2L (North Face dogfish) hydration pack a largish bumbag stuffed with special K muffin bars and a hand bottle with powdered poweraid.  After checking out the others gear I realized that I was actually carrying the least.

The first 30km section was bloody hilly but the pace was manageable, there was lots of sensible walking going up the steeper hills. I remember the GPS wavering from 114m to 850m above sea level. We filled our bottles in a stream and kept up a respectable 5:20 marathon pace.  Coming up to Narrowneck (past Taro’s plaque) was very beautiful the views were as good as I can remember in any run I’ve done. Climbing on sheer rock up pegs stuck into the wall really stuffed up our average pace but was loads of fun all the same.

Once we topped narrowneck we gradually climbed to over 1000m elevation for the first time that day.  Six mountain bike riders flew by and one dropped a “golden breed” fleece beanie, which I quickly turned into a souvenir.

I lost Mr G and Sleepy and felt weak and couldn’t keep up but trudged along for the next 6km or so, had a panadol but generally felt like shit. We got our first aid at around the marathon mark where Jan retired due to knee pain and so it was down to three of us.  As usual aid station supremo, Skizzik, put on a fantastic array of hot and cold offerings, she really knows how to spoil an ultrarunner.  After stuffing my face with fried rice, Pringles, Jolt cola and hot coffee we set off again. Mr G noted that “it’s a healthy sport”.

I decided to drop the pack and continue with a hand bottle and a few nutri grain chock malt bars.  Travelling through the streets of Medlow Bath (?) or was it Katoomba was hilly but comforting because we were close to help if needed. Ended up on a railway track which was a bit too beaten for my liking but undulating enough to allow some decent aerobic exercise.

I was cursing my shoes (Montrail Leona Divide) because they have lost most of their cushion after 1200km of running and racing. It was these shoes that I used in Morocco earlier this year and running w/ a pack has taken most of the spring out of them, I think I compared them to running on clay pavers without the weight.

We ended up getting to the Katoomba airstrip later that afternoon and needed to wait for a while. I was starting to come good and was getting impatient and saying things like “hey ho lets go!”. I sponged some support off Sleepy’s better half and was getting ready to go when Skizzik turned up with a huge serving of hot chips.

Stuffed my face again and got going. The drop down into Grand Canyon was steep and 50/50 technical but I was starting to feel good and raced off then took a wrong turn and rejoined the others again before deciding to push hard on the climb up to Evans lookout. For those of you that have never been down to the bottom of that climb that goes up to Evans Lookout it is definitely worth putting on the list. Very rain foresty and damp and mossy, bit like the cradle mountain area in Tassie.

Arrived at Evans lookout at about 5pm where Mr G stopped due to a deteriorating Achilles tendon.  More food, don lights and off again. Odometer reading roughly 70km.

The run down to Pulpit Rock was fun in the dusk, quite fast with Sleepy setting a pace that we were both comfortable with.  Arrived at Pulpit Rock at around 8Pm (?), both still feeling quite good, the wind now up and the temp dropping quickly.

We descended down a very technical section to Blue Gum where we were suspending ourselves with arms over drops and doing lots of sitting then lowering down steep drops. Running through Blue Gum Forest I realized I was out of food and only had a bit of powdered poweraid left. No matter, I was ok and I’d had a decent whack of calories so far anyways.

Almost forgot. Mr G and Skizzik called me and advised that they had two large pizzas but we’d been decending for 30min and to turn around and go back would have added another 1:30 onto the trip so we declined, dumb move because I was hungry.

The next section traced a river around to Burra Corain Flat. It was here that I sent an sms to Mr G saying.. “4.5km away, thinking of pizza”.

Soon after this we were off the track and in a state of navigational confusion. We followed the path but seemed to keep losing it.  My heart said keep going, we seemed to be going deeper and deeper into scrub and heading into wilderness, no where near a road nor any marked track on the map that we were using. If the track existed at all, back burning and landslides had covered it up.

It was now getting very late and we were sure that people were starting to get concerned.  We were ok, I had a polypro top and a beanie and Sleepy was well dressed too. We had maps and good lights and it wasn’t as cold in the valley as on the peaks, so we knew we'd be safe.

After lots of tracking then back tracking and stopping and looking at maps, at 1:30am, we were resigned to the fact that we’d probably need to spend the night out. One small problem was that I needed to keep moving because when I stopped I’d get cold. Sleepy was carrying a small niggle in his knee but was still moving at the same speed as before.

By this stage I was very hungry and sleepy offered me his Picnic bar, which I considered eating despite my peanut allergy. Luckily he did have a backup candy bar (a Boost?) which we shared. So with half a boost under the belt I knew that we’d need to capitalize on the calories.  We did find a path, which wasn’t on the topo maps and decided to follow it with a fast walk/trot type, we knew that if it was a proper path (unlike the shit paths that we found previously, all overgrown and not used in years), then it would lead somewhere eventually and that we were probably still traveling at least twice as fast as any (most) bushwalker/s would.

My cdma phone was out of range but at 2am I did get Mr G’s message sent at 11:30pm asking “are you guys ok?”.

It was good how neither of us doubted for one second that we wouldn’t be ok (after all, Jan and Lawrence survived much tougher conditions at Bogong a couple of months back). This confidence certainly helped us make decisions. As a team we decided to back track and if needed go all the way back to pulpit rock, even though we knew that it would be extremely tough going up that bloody hill. There was no way we wanted to be rescued, no need..

We got to the end of the unknown track; we were at a river with a fork.  There was nowhere to go. It’s now 3am and we’ve been going since 7:30am and while tired we’re still travelling at a good speed. After about 30min of searching for a trailhead by rock hopping to various parts of the riverbank we found some chalk marks on some rocks.

Eventually we found a trailhead, which we were later told is “invisible in the day, so I don’t know how you found it at night”

We came a cross a sign that pointed to Victoria Falls (1hr 50min). We got to Vic falls at around 3:45am after gunning it up a very long steep hill.  We were very relieved to get to the falls and walked the last section eventually emerging from our little adventure at 4:15am (I think).

Mr G and Skizzik were in the Vic Falls carpark asleep in the car.  I must say that was the best cold pizza I have tasted in a while.

Shook hands with Sleepy and our little adventure was over.

Who needs the Gold Coast Marathon when we can rub our chins and imagine what lies beyond those hills.

I’d call it a great hitout! Bring on the Gold Coast Kokoda Challenge in two weeks.

Thanks to Skizzik and Lois for fantastic support. And to Mister G for a great concept.  "I'll pe peck"

Edited by Virtual, 04 July 2006 - 12:33 AM.