59 replies to this topic

[Gronk]

Any plans for this in 2009 ?

[Jogger]

I haven't picked a date yet. The issue is that the National Parks people have rumbled me and have spoken to me about organised runs in the Royal National Park saying I have to comply with their guidelines. The last 2 years we have had approx 150+ runners so its too many to get by unnoticed. Unfortunately they have my email and phone number now and know I live in the area!

I am still considering it but it would only be announced on CoolRunning with very little notice, maybe only a week.

I also organising a run from Garie Beach on behalf of Sydney Striders on Sunday 27th December (assuming the suggestion gets accepted by the calendar committee - else it will be come one come all) with a variety of options, with the longest being 30km. That run is unlikely to be the Otford-Bundeena but will be some similar terrain & of course excellent training for six foot.

On the other hand I may try to comply with their demands but I have this feeling that it won't pan out right. Normally the only approved runs are on Lady Carrington Drive, which is of course a great run, but not what I want to do (there is a run there this coming weekend ..)

[Greg_Waite]

Why not give the permit a go this year Kev, and write your own guidelines and case in it? I just got our first permit for many years for Fraser Island, which two years ago would have been impossible. But it was carefully structured, as a trial run with a field limit, to be evaluated to inform event size and management in future years (see attachment  090706_Fraser_Is_event_outline.doc   82.5K   8 downloads).

I think you'd have a good chance of success, given that the parks service know the demand is there and informal runs will happen anyway - if not you, someone else will organise it. That route its too good not to use!

I know you're not keen on bureaucracy, fair enough too, but having a regular run there is a good way to generate a team interested in doing the setup regularly - it could still be a self-supported event, not a formal race with aid stations etc. That's a harder sell to the park service of course - they don't really understand trail events and are so risk-averse - but everyone on an organised group event is safer than doing it alone.

It would be good if we had some organised multi-day self-supported events in Australia, more like the UK mountain marathons, to help build understanding of the capacity of trail runners to look after their own safety, and also the value of less formal events.

Edited by Greg_Waite, 06 December 2009 - 07:12 AM.

[sigatoka]

Hello Kev,
I'd like to keep a secret... when will this run happen? I realise you said you'd let people know a week or less before, but that's a bit tough on runners from country Vic... any chance you could let me know, on the very quiet?
JohnvT

[pipi]

Greg_Waite, on Aug 25 2009, 07:19 AM, said:

Why not give the permit a go this year Kev, and write your own guidelines and case in it? I just got our first permit for many years for Fraser Island, which two years ago would have been impossible. But it was carefully structured, as a trial run with a field limit, to be evaluated to inform event size and management in future years (see attachment 090706_F..._outline.doc).

It is the current policy of the Royal National Park to disallow any organised running on single width walking track.  The main concerns are that many feet passing through will do damage to the track, and that non-suspecting bushwalkers will be scared or otherwise discouraged by encountering a runner or several runners coming along a walking track.

Any proposal would probably have to include a marshal at every track head to politely inform any walker that runners will be coming through and to politely suggest an alternative walk if they do not want to share the trail with runners on that day.  The proposal should also include some documentation on sites where trail runs already exist in NSW on walking tracks, and, some form of survey to quantify how much if any damage is done to the track.  There is also concern about potential injuries occuring in locations where a person could not be stretchered out.

The current beleif is that walking tracks are built for walkers only, and other uses like running should not be encouraged.  That is, they are not a multi-user track system.

We have the same problem in Wollongong, which I believe is in the same region for management purposes as the Royal.  My feeling is that there could be a permit if a huge amount of work is done and many many people are commited to be marshals.  However, the process would take many months and might even have more people volunteering than running - which sort of defeats the purpose.  Another approach might be to wait in the hope that management is influenced by other regions in NSW that do allow trail running on walking tracks???

[wadaye]

It's all a bit silly really. If people use the national parks then they will have more people caring for the national park and perhaps looking after it too.
I would think running the road would be far more dangerous.

Perhaps somebody just needs to propose a time when they will be running, without actually organising a run!

[Jogger]

Quote

somebody just needs to propose a time when they will be running, without actually organising a run!

that's all that ever happened !

flash mob

[Jogger]

saturday 5th december 2009, main start at 7am, but encouraging people to start early in the spirit of "no rules".

for this year's run, a superb early training run for sixfoot, we are encouraging people to run with a buddy so no one should get lost by themself, or injured.

i had discussed with npws earlier this year who told me that groups of 20 people are ok. I have spoken to members of coolrunning, fatass, striders & bushies who will all be in attendance. If we get more than 20 people then we will separate into groups.

please please please, do not drop any litter incl toilet paper else you will have 5000 years worth of bad karma following you around. and probably an uppercut.

i think all of the overgrown tracks have been cut back this year so the going should be really good. bring your swimmers for a dip in the sea at bundeena - and a couple of $ for a cold drink - will be a perfect finish ....

fyi:
http://www.coolrunni...ord_to_Bundeena

[Mick]

I'm keen, I had to sell my soul (do the dishes for a week) for a leave pass. Will probably mean I don't do the Entrance HM, but how can I turn up the chance to see some great trail.

Expecting another coasty to make the journey.

Is Out&Back a sensible idea ?

[littleblackpug]

Mick, on Nov 24 2009, 08:10 PM, said:

I'm keen, I had to sell my soul (do the dishes for a week) for a leave pass. Will probably mean I don't do the Entrance HM, but how can I turn up the chance to see some great trail.

Expecting another coasty to make the journey.

Is Out&Back a sensible idea ?

Great news Mick, you will love it. Out and back is really cool on this track, you'd be fine. But there's always people who can give you a ride back to the start as well. Quite tempted to do the out and back myself but better behave myself due to my stupid hip.

What do you mean not do the HM as well, I did the double in 2007, come on



Also beware there are a lot of snakes on this trail, saw 2 brown snakes during an out and back run here 4 weeks ago.

[HouseDad]

I'm definitely in, as I stuffed this run up big time last year trying to keep up with LBP, which resulted in a DNF. A lesson learned that day, so this time round, a steady pace and enjoy the view.

House Dad.

[Ourimbah]

I keep hearing about this run from Beaver.. So it is a good time to come and have a look.

Looking forward to it,should be a great day

[SlowManiac]

I will be there, prob out 'n back but sloooooow.

[Ponkey]

Ourimbah, on Nov 25 2009, 07:08 AM, said:

I keep hearing about this run from Beaver.. So it is a good time to come and have a look.

Looking forward to it,should be a great day

After your success at GNW100 I thought you were putting your feet up for the rest of the year ?

Agree with Beaver this is a great run. Its where Russell has been doing all his sekrit training for Kepler. Out and back is a good run.

Watch out for the snakes! I will be thinking of you guys in the heat of the day as I climb through the snowline at Kepler!

Edited by Ponkey, 25 November 2009 - 11:11 AM.

[Coogee1979M]

I'm not a big fan of snakes, but I'll give this run a go anyway.

On the bright side, there is a 12 Km run on the same day that costs $65, so 29 Km for $0 is very good value.

[Ourimbah]

Ponkey, on Nov 25 2009, 12:10 PM, said:

After GNW100 I thought you were putting your feet up for the rest of the year ?

I am,only doing the 27km.I am on a diet of 30 km's per week until 1st Jan.

Nothing to hard just social..It's a bit tough but the wife is sick of crewing.

D

[trailpuddin]

SlowManiac, on Nov 25 2009, 09:20 AM, said:

I will be there, prob out 'n back

I'll take a moments pause from my ice cream eating at Bundeena to wave you on your way for the 2nd leg.  

Planning a 6.30am start, a couple of spare seats in a car leaving bundeena 6am.
TP

[littleblackpug]

Coogee1979M, on Nov 27 2009, 05:50 PM, said:

I'm not a big fan of snakes

Just run with HouseDad, he'll protect you  

[tim]

I have run this a few times and still get lost.  Last time LBP and I ran it we almost ran on top of 2 snakes and rescued on turtle.  The coffee is always good at Bundeena and running back is nice but I have C2K the following week.  i will be there since it is a good run.  It is always HOT and most people run out of water.  But i am getting a Tiller stomach and can now drink out of puddles on the way.

[HouseDad]

littleblackpug, on Nov 27 2009, 09:42 PM, said:

Just run with HouseDad, he'll protect you  

That's right LBP, I'm so tough and have such an extensive knowledge of Australian wildlife

Seriously though, the advice about buddying up is worth heeding, as I got horribly lost last year, as there's paths going off in all directions, on some sections. So if you want to run at a slower pace, then buddy up with me Coogee.

HouseDad.

[Jogger]

Just to save people asking, today there is a total fire ban and the paths are closed.
This is what the NPWS say about fire bans/path closures.
In case this also happens next weekend, I want to make my own position clear : this is not an organised run, race or event, its just a bunch of people turning up. So in a fire ban/path closed situation, you just follow your own conscience at your own risk.

It sounds like the NPWS decide on Fri afternoon what will happen on Saturday.

What will I do ? Not sure and I doubt I will publish here.

[milov]

Hey all,

I am hoping to get a lift down... Is anyone passing through the eastern suburbs?

Michael
0403 592 201

[IheartBoston]

Hi, I am looking for a ride from the city (Surry Hills) to the start.  Anyone going my way ?

[Running Angel]

Owly and I will be running (slowly!). Hoping to start a bit earlier but train doesn't get to Otford till around 6.40

[Jogger]

Happy to pick up people from bundeena Wharf (the finish) approx 6am-6.15am and give a lift to Otford (the start). Saves you screwing around post-run.

[Mick]

SlowManiac, on Nov 25 2009, 09:20 AM, said:

I will be there, prob out 'n back but sloooooow.

My usual running buddies are taking it easy and only doing the one way option.

I hope a few others are doing the O&B option ?

Terry ?

[ScamBullant]

Organising cars from Mts at the moment. Should have a couple coming down to go for a jog in the Royal on Sat and it appears some sydney siders had the same idea.

In looking at this course I had heard there are some water holes midway along that are good for a swim. Can this be confirmed, Im hoping as it was a major selling point when convincing a number of people that Blue isnt the only nat pk (even though we all know it is the best).

[Jogger]

Scam,

swimming spots en route:
- werrong nudie beach (2km off track and 2km back again), only km from the start
- burning palms beach
- garie beach
- wattamolla lagoon (absolutely brilliant)
- wattamolla rock pool (1km past wattamolla, if enough rain - ok at the moment)
- curracorang cove
- little marley beach - good
- big marley beach - good but dangerous rips
- finish @ Bundeena - beautiful

[HouseDad]

Any word on conditions down that way JK & LBP? Last year was a scorcher!

House Dad.

Edited by HouseDad, 03 December 2009 - 06:48 PM.

[littleblackpug]

HouseDad, on Dec 3 2009, 07:46 PM, said:

Any word on conditions down that way JK & LBP? Last year was a scorcher!

House Dad.

There's been quite a cool breeze, very strong on the coast, blowing all week

[SlowManiac]

Kev could I grab a lift please?

[HouseDad]

littleblackpug, on Dec 3 2009, 07:59 PM, said:

There's been quite a cool breeze, very strong on the coast, blowing all week

Thanks LBP. Looking forward to the run and seeing your Gnarly toe-nails make an appearance. If they are as bad as you say, we'll use them for the Fugly Race Injury profile picture!

House Dad.

[ScamBullant]

JoggerK, on Dec 3 2009, 06:06 PM, said:

Scam,

swimming spots en route:
- werrong nudie beach (2km off track and 2km back again), only km from the start
- burning palms beach
- garie beach
- wattamolla lagoon (absolutely brilliant)
- wattamolla rock pool (1km past wattamolla, if enough rain - ok at the moment)
- curracorang cove
- little marley beach - good
- big marley beach - good but dangerous rips
- finish @ Bundeena - beautiful

Might have to let She Who Must Be Obeyed know I could be late home with that many swimming options. Sounds like the perfect day out. Run, get hot, swim, cool down, run get hot, swim cool down. Definately looking forward to it.

[SlowManiac]

SlowManiac, on Dec 3 2009, 08:33 PM, said:

Kev could I grab a lift please?

I have another plan, so I won't need the lift thanks

[Mick]

SlowManiac, on Dec 3 2009, 09:28 PM, said:

I have another plan, so I won't need the lift thanks

There won't be check points with cups of tea on this run you know.

You SURE you will be ok ?

[Running Angel]

Carmen, on Dec 3 2009, 10:38 PM, said:

I can't run this, but my son and I might come down to Bundeena for a swim on Saturday and maybe I'll see some of my favourite fat asses.

fat asses have to be better than saggy tits any day eh Carmen?

[cliffold]

JoggerK, on Dec 3 2009, 05:43 PM, said:

Happy to pick up people from bundeena Wharf (the finish) approx 6am-6.15am and give a lift to Otford (the start). Saves you screwing around post-run.

Thanks Kev, would like a lift from the wharf tomorrow

[pipi]

JoggerK, on Nov 23 2009, 10:32 AM, said:

i think all of the overgrown tracks have been cut back this year so the going should be really good.

Quiet a few stumps from the cut back scrub are sticking about 15 cm out of the ground and will trip you up if you are not watching your feet or running on the main single trail.

I hope to come along.  I intend to catch the train scheduled to arrive at Otford at five past seven.  A late start, but I don't think it matters.  The weather looks good for this time of year.

[Jogger]

Quote

Quiet a few stumps from the cut back scrub are sticking about 15 cm out of the ground and will trip you up if you are not watching your feet or running on the main single trail.

yes very true.

All my car spots are gone - cliffold & hatless x3

[hatless]

JoggerK, on Dec 4 2009, 11:45 AM, said:

All my car spots are gone - cliffold & hatless x3

I only need one spot now, so I guess there are two spots still open.

h.

[Jogger]

I just wanted to remind everyone that there are a couple of options for the finishing approach of the run:
http://www.coolrunni...deenafinish.pdf

The Sandy Track, first right when you hit the bitumen, now has a signpost "Jibbon Loop Track" or similar.
The Sandy Track is the preferred route for obvious reasons (puts hair on your chest)!

[MissZ]

JoggerK, on Dec 5 2009, 12:50 AM, said:

The Sandy Track is the preferred route for obvious reasons (puts hair on your chest)!

I still have nightmares about the sandy track.

I hope you're all having a great day out there. Much kinder weather than last year.

[littleblackpug]

MissZ, on Dec 5 2009, 11:05 AM, said:

I still have nightmares about the sandy track.

I hope you're all having a great day out there. Much kinder weather than last year.

I missed you out there today MissZ! But had the pleasure otherwise of the company of the lovely SpaghettiLegs who kept me honest.

The sandy track is quite good these days as they have really cut it right back and as a result there's firmer ground to run on the the high sides of the trail.

Didn't beat my O2B pb (3:50), but pretty happy with a solid effort for 3:52.

From the way we went out and the pace he maintained the Six Foot Sicko's form is looking good    

As always the company was great, the track awesome, the social at the finish line, the Carmen Cupcakes and the swim = fabulous.

Edited by littleblackpug, 05 December 2009 - 04:16 PM.

[ScamBullant]

A great morning running in the Royal, having left the familiar safety of the Blue with B06, Dr Phil aka Flying Fist, The Welsh Exchange Student, Mr & Mrs Train and Mr & Mrs Donga (all hail the prince), to experience this coastal run and get a feel for what life in the Blue will be like post global warming.

A 5am meeting and departure from the arches of Blaxland saw us arriving at Bundeena a little latter than estimated for the finish car drop. A slight detoured back to Bundeena about 5mins after leaving to drive to the start after B06 realised that when everyone else was placing finish line clothing in the remaining cars he was in fact not. Finally reached Otford for a tail end BMMC only 7.30am start.

The plan had been to regroup continually along the run with aim of a swim at one of many options along the way. The absurdity of photo suggestions certainly helped with these re groupings and with the two maternally connected doing the back and forth a couple of time everyone made it through the first 2hrs together quite well. Brilliant sights along the way made the 4.30am rise more justified. Having particularly enjoyed running through the tiny community's along the way singing 'Morning has broken'.

Most grateful for the aid station in the car park. Confirming that our slight detour around the tanks had been corrected (however the associated headland was well worth the journey). Having refilled water containers we promptly ran off in the wrong direction enabling some to take the desired swim across the lagoon whilst others (now known as BMMC Sherpas carried their phones et al).

The latter parts of the run became quite hot and I was grateful for the relief of the breeze that came by on occasions. More great views and an increasing rate of perplexed walkers meet us through these last parts. The last section also saw the demise of the regroup concept and by the time the end of the coastal track was reached it was only the Welsh exchange student, Dr Phil and I together with others in front and behind respectively given there position in relation to us. A quick sub committee meeting and the (grow some chest hairs) sandy trail option was selected.

One final extra 2mins at the end of the point before cruising through the beaches and streets of Bundeena to finish at the Fringe Cafe in 3hrs 57mins 24secs. Overall a tougher day out for me than I had planned. Guess it was just one of those days you don't have the rhythm in your stride. Very much enjoyed the track however and would love to come back to the Royal at a latter date to run this course again. Particularly with a chance to explore more swimming options.

Edited by ScamBullant, 05 December 2009 - 04:57 PM.

[HouseDad]

I've been sulking a whole year, since a DNF on this run last time round, due to trying to keep up with LBP and blowing out at 8k, lack of experience and treating the event as a run/tanning session! So this year, I took it nice and sensibly, with the aim of just finishing and running at a nice easy pace. I had a lovely time too and enjoyed the scenery, especially the bits from the car park onwards, that I didn't get to see last time. I even stopped for a swim in the dam, just after the water stop, which was just wonderful.

Had my first encounter with an Australian snake at 17k   It was big and brown and frightened the life out of me. So much so, that after nearly stepping on it, I flew head over heels, cutting my hands. Boy did my heart rate go up!

Romped home in 04:05 feeling happy as, only to find out that I missed the last beach, meaning I'd cut the whole dam thing short. Saying that, I took so many wrong turns to Bundeena, I'm sure I made up for the lost 2k.

It was wonderful as ever, to catch up with ALL my CR friends, who are just the nicest bunch of people you could ever wish to meet.

Sore and non-sulking House Dad.

[Bert]

Hi Housedad.
Was your brown snake curled up on the "magic carpet" (ie the raised metalic mesh trail)? Somwhere along there Lotsahare and I were making fair time down a sloping bit where the undergrowth was hanging over the mesh. I was in front, and as I went I was calling out where there were steps, to warn Lotsahare. So the dialogue went something like: Step...Step...Woops, Snake! As I pushed past a bit of bush, there was a pretty big brown snake curled up on the left half of the mesh, actually taking up a fair bit more than half, By the time I saw it I was thoroughly committed to my next step, which landed right alongside the snake. Probably needless to say that I did not stop right there, but went on for a couple more steps. The snake must have been in a good mood, as it just crawled off the track and into the bush. Fortunately Lotsahare was far enough back that she was able to stop before she got to the snake, and give it time to get clear.
Apart from that little excitement we had a pretty quiet and pleasant (and slow) run, conditions being vastly better than last year's heat wave. Good to meet some new CRs and some old friends. Many thanks to Trailpuddin and Michael for the lift to from Bundeena to Otford.
Bert & Lotsahare.

[HouseDad]

Bert, on Dec 5 2009, 08:53 PM, said:

Hi Housedad.
Was your brown snake curled up on the "magic carpet" (ie the raised metalic mesh trail)?

Hey Bert, no my big brown and scary buddy was on the climb out of the second to last beach. I jumped across some rocks and landed millimetres from him/her. Luckily, we both scared the bejesus out of each other, and he/she slithered off, leaving me tumbling along on all fours   Boy, was my heart racing, I don't think I've ever been so scared! I ran the next 2-kilometers carrying a rock in each hand, with the idea of throwing the rocks ahead of me, if I saw another one, to startle, not hurt it. I decided to drop the rocks though, after coming across some walkers, who looked disturbed at seeing a red-faced sweaty guy, in the middle of nowhere, armed with rocks - not a good look!

Great day though aye,

House Dad.