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Hellgate Gorge 21 April 07


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#1 Twopennys

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Posted 27 January 2007 - 10:11 PM

Hi all,

Introducing the Hellgate Gorge Fat Ass.

Taking in a part of the Six Foot Track the course is a loop that crosses the Jenolan Gorge twice. It is a demanding and spectacular course.

There are 2 options available:

46kms - one loop Jenolan Jaunt option
92kms - two loops Hellgate Hardcase option

It's the most fun you can have standing up B)

For more info click here

Edit: Have modified distances for accuracy (again - but definitely for the last time :D ).

Cheers, 2P :)

Edited by Twopennys, 31 January 2007 - 11:52 AM.


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#2 Spud

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Posted 28 January 2007 - 09:27 AM

Perfect 2P!
I'm in for 2 loops.  :)

#3 tim

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Posted 28 January 2007 - 04:38 PM

cool.

#4 rodthehornet

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Posted 28 January 2007 - 07:10 PM

Will be a starter for option 1.  Should I survive this, I will support runners on option 2.  


Cheers
The Hornet

#5 Twopennys

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Posted 29 January 2007 - 05:54 PM

Some maps added here

Cheers, 2P

Edited by Twopennys, 29 January 2007 - 06:00 PM.


#6 Amigo

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Posted 31 January 2007 - 11:36 AM

Hi 2P

I read your report and am definitely interested in the one loop option.  I have walked though and camped in Hellgate Gorge along the Jenolan R so I am familiar with some of the course.  
The run sounds great.  The hills are huge but then you wouldn't do if it didn't hurt... a bit!

Possibly arrive on the Friday night, then get an early start on the Saturday...

Looking forward to it...

Cheers

Amigo

#7 inekuips

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Posted 06 February 2007 - 12:39 PM

Nice work 2P. I am going to try to make it for the Jenolan Jaunt option.  I just don't think I am hard core enough for 2 laps! :wacko:  Happy to support opt2 runners along with Mr Hornet though.  Thats if people are prepared to eat watermelon...

ine

#8 Will

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Posted 08 February 2007 - 12:29 PM

I'll have to check, but if nothing planned already on that day, I'd like to give the Jenolan Jaunt option a try.

#9 Will

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 08:40 AM

Just bringing this back up. I am definitely interested!

Is it still on the 21st 2P? because you told me 28th on Saturday...

Keep us posted!

#10 Twopennys

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 09:39 AM

View PostWill, on Mar 13 2007, 09:40 AM, said:

Just bringing this back up. I am definitely interested!

Is it still on the 21st 2P? because you told me 28th on Saturday...

Keep us posted!


Yep - still the 21st Will, sorry for the confusion - I was less coherent than usual on Saturday :rolleyes:

So who else is in?

I class the course as a bit tougher than Six Foot with more elevation gain/loss. One of the 'ups' and one of the 'downs' are generally steeper and more sustained than the Mini Mini/Pluvio combo. There is also one very steep but short section (800m) with no trail and of course there will be no aid stations (though I will be putting out a water drop at 20.5k on the Friday night before). NB not trying to detract from 6ft (genuflects) just using it as a comparison to let you know what you are in for. I'm guessing (wildly) that 6ft time x 1.25 would give you an idea of how long you would be out there for one loop.

The timing was designed to suit anyone wanting to take the next step in trail running post 6ft.

May also be of use to Western Staters if taken in large enough doses - though if the condition of feeling the need to do rediculously long trail runs in the lead up to Western States after this persists please consult your coach and/or mental health professional.

Scenery is unbelievable.

My plan is to camp at the Deviation campground i.e. the start/finish the Friday night before. Given I have a previously unscheduled trip to Thailand at end March early April I will not be training hard for this and will probably only do one loop at an easy pace.

I will also get some better maps up on the website over the next 2 weeks.

Watch this space

Cheers, 2P

#11 Paul Every

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 10:00 AM

An unfortunate clash of dates with Coburg 24 Hour. A week later and you could have counted me in for sure.

#12 Mister G

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 10:18 AM

Should be there.

#13 Becky O

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 01:36 PM

2P, is there any chance of a shorter option than the 46km, say 30 odd?

Just asking as I am going to my coach's camp for 10 days from 6th April - 15th April, so I have a feeling I may be a little trashed, but I'd still like to come along.

#14 Twopennys

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 02:51 PM

View PostBecky O, on Mar 13 2007, 02:36 PM, said:

2P, is there any chance of a shorter option than the 46km, say 30 odd?

Just asking as I am going to my coach's camp for 10 days from 6th April - 15th April, so I have a feeling I may be a little trashed, but I'd still like to come along.

Not as a round trip Becky - but there would be nothing stopping you doing an out and back from the Deviation to the Jenolan Campground via the caves and return (25k) or in the reverse direction from the Deviation to the Jenolan River via Moorara Boss Fire Trail and return (22k) - though I wouldn't recommend the latter option on your own - it is pretty remote and the other runners wouldn't be coming through there for hours.

Cheers, 2P

#15 Twopennys

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 04:47 PM

I'm not clever enough to superimpose these but here is an elevation comparison Six Foot Vs Hellgate

SportTracks puts Six Foot +1279/-1499

Attached File  SixFootE.jpg   22.81K   12 downloads

Hellgate +1834/-1840 (actually it will be a bit more as I accidently had my Garmin switched off for about 3 k of undulating ground).

Attached File  HellgateGorgeE.jpg   23.1K   19 downloads

#16 inganbangan

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 05:04 PM

I'm interested.

Actually, Im so interested that I'll be there if nothing else pops up for the weekend (work tends to do that to me). One lap only for me...though perhaps I could go another 4 kms to clock up a 50 km.

#17 rodthehornet

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 08:25 PM

Still in for this one.  Have to move house the week before so will be hectic time.  

Have you got a start time worked out??  
What sort of gear are you recommending to take out.??  

I know we are all big boys and girls, but it is pretty remote area, so a few must haves might be in order.


The Hornet

#18 Horrie

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 09:22 PM

I am aiming to be there. It will depend on how I pull up after the Canberra 50km the week before.

#19 Twopennys

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Posted 13 March 2007 - 09:33 PM

View Postrodthehornet, on Mar 13 2007, 08:25 PM, said:

I know we are all big boys and girls, but it is pretty remote area, so a few must haves might be in order.
The Hornet

Good point Hornet - as it is unlikely that runners will see anyone not associated with this run on the climb from the Jenolan Campground to the Kanangra Road and the Blood Filly and Moorara Boss Fire Trails - they should be prepared to be self-sufficient. Also being in late April and given a lot of this run is above 1000m (see profile a couple of posts back) the weather could potentially turn ugly - who knows  :rolleyes:

Most people this run attracts will know what to bring. No one will be left behind but taking a few particular items may be the difference between being relatively comfortable or completely miserable (or worse) till the cavalry arrives. Ultimately everyone needs to be responsible for themselves and what they take, but the kinds of things I will be taking (apart from food and drink) in the car and making a final decision on the morning will be:

- some basic first aid gear (1 x roller bandage, 1 x triangular bandage, elastoplast, pain killers, vaseline)
- space blanket or bag
- weatherproof jacket
- beanie
- lightweight gloves
- thermal top
- thermal duds
- headlamp (if I do decide to do 2 laps or the weather looks really crap)
- whistle (not pea type)

I've set the start time for 8:00AM to allow folks travelling from Sydney time to get there - but as I will be there overnight I could be persuaded to start it earlier.

Cheers, 2P

Edited by Twopennys, 13 March 2007 - 09:41 PM.


#20 rodthehornet

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Posted 14 March 2007 - 07:05 PM

Thanks 2P - I can safely assume that there is no mobile coverage where we are going??  8am is not bad -  Still tossing up whether to drive up or sleep in the wagon.  Anyone wants to carpool from Sydney, PM and we can work things out (driving not sleeping in the back of the wagon).


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#21 Twopennys

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Posted 14 March 2007 - 07:26 PM

Hornet, I took my mobile on the recce and with one exception there was no service everytime I checked it - certainly none at the start/finish.

The one exception was at the junction of Moorara Boss and Black Range.

Having said that - I wasn't constantly checking it either.

Cheers, 2P

#22 Virtual

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Posted 17 March 2007 - 08:24 AM

cdma works better.   I've pencilled this one in.

#23 Twopennys

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Posted 20 March 2007 - 05:22 PM

Bump

Maps are now up here

The interest list so far:

Spud
Tim (?) I'm not sure if "cool" is an expression of interest or just an observation
rodthehornet
Amigo
Inekuips
Will
Mr G
Becky O (maybe a shorter out & back)
inganbangan
Horrie
Virtual
2P
KT
Blue Dog
Martin Dougdale
R2B

I will be doing 2 water drops - one at Mt Lakeman (approx 20k) and another at the junction of Black Range and Moorara Boss Fire Trail (approx 39k).

Cheers, 2P

Edited by Twopennys, 23 March 2007 - 09:44 AM.


#24 Jogger

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Posted 20 March 2007 - 07:02 PM

I am interested, but I have a high pike rate.

#25 Twopennys

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Posted 20 March 2007 - 07:31 PM

View PostKevinTiller, on Mar 20 2007, 08:02 PM, said:

I am interested, but I have a high pike rate.

Think of it as Six Foot without the stress - and you even get to run :rolleyes:

Love to see you there mate.

Cheers, 2P

#26 Spud

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Posted 20 March 2007 - 07:35 PM

View PostKevinTiller, on Mar 20 2007, 08:02 PM, said:

I am interested, but I have a high pike rate.

It's better to pike than dns..looking forward to this one.  :rolleyes:

#27 tim

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Posted 20 March 2007 - 09:15 PM

View PostTwopennys, on Mar 20 2007, 05:22 PM, said:

Tim (?) I'm not sure if "cool" is an expression of interest or just an observation


cool = running it :rolleyes:

#28 Twopennys

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Posted 20 March 2007 - 10:31 PM

View Posttim, on Mar 20 2007, 09:15 PM, said:

cool = running it :rolleyes:

So noted - dig out those old KT's Tim - this is one run where for sure that tread pattern will come in handy :LOL:

#29 Blue Dog

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Posted 21 March 2007 - 07:30 AM

Count me in 2P.

I hope Tim wears his Nike Frees again.

Dog. :rolleyes:

#30 tim

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Posted 21 March 2007 - 08:13 AM

you're a funny boy doggie.

#31 inganbangan

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Posted 21 March 2007 - 09:08 AM

I'm planning on driving (or getting a lift) in the morning. I live in Glenmore Park (near Penrith). If anyone want's a lift I'd appreciate the company. If anyone wants to give me a lift, I'd appreciate the ride. I'm planning on 1 lap, asusming I make it that far. If you're gonna run quickly and need to rush back to Sydney, best not bet on a ride home from me!

Edited by inganbangan, 21 March 2007 - 09:46 AM.


#32 Martin Dugdale

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Posted 21 March 2007 - 08:07 PM

Oh no, got to get back into training!

I suppose I had better do this. feed the rat, as Kevin says. better let the others know.  :rolleyes:

#33 Run 2 Become

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Posted 23 March 2007 - 09:23 AM

:rolleyes: I'm in!

#34 tim

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Posted 23 March 2007 - 10:20 AM

Life has forced me to decide between Canberra and this one.  So the question is do I want to run 50km on a road with cars and 100's of people or do I want to run on a trail with breath taking views, wild life, a bunch of fatass people and maybe whilst the sun is setting a cow will chase me down a hill.

Not much to think about really :rolleyes:

#35 Spud

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Posted 23 March 2007 - 10:43 AM

View Posttim, on Mar 23 2007, 11:20 AM, said:

Life has forced me to decide between Canberra and this one.  So the question is do I want to run 50km on a road with cars and 100's of people or do I want to run on a trail with breath taking views, wild life, a bunch of fatass people and maybe whilst the sun is setting a cow will chase me down a hill.

Not much to think about really :rolleyes:

Yep Tim, it's a no brainer, more specific training too for WS. :LOL:

#36 Thomas

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 06:13 AM

talk about anguishing between Canberra and Hellgate. But the pull of the mountains is too great.

Just need to decide now -will I JJ or HH!

#37 Twopennys

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 08:33 AM

You can't rush a good decision Thomas - besides you have up until the end of the first lap to make it :rolleyes:

Now since we have a new page the updated interest list is:

Spud
Tim
rodthehornet
Amigo
Inekuips
Will
Mr G
Becky O (maybe a shorter out & back)
inganbangan
Horrie
Virtual
2P
KT
Blue Dog
Martin Dougdale
R2B
Thomas
Milov

Better start fattening up the mice in the photocopier.

Edited by Twopennys, 26 March 2007 - 03:37 PM.


#38 Thomas

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 02:23 PM

With the deviation camp ground is it just roll up and pitch a tent or is there a more formal process?

Also if in reality the Jenolan Jaunt is 6ft x 1.25, would I be right in saying that a 12 hour 12 foot would equate to more than 15hr hellgate? As a second lap of hellgate must be at least return 6ft x 1.45-2 (for arguments sake) as the return on 12 ft is easier than the first half but this is obviously not the case for Hellgate being a double loop?

#39 Twopennys

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 04:01 PM

Thomas the campground is very much just turn up and pitch a tent affair.

As for the 6ft x 1.25 that is just a wild guestimation on my part based on there being no aid every few k's so you have to carry stuff and that some of the hills are a bit steeper than 6ft.

It is a bit hard to draw too many conclusions from when I did the recce because I was carrying half the inventory of a Kathmandu store at the time and was very much in cruise mode. That took me 9 hours and I'm a 6 hour Six Foot runner. I expect to go between 7 & 8 hours in April.

I've never done 12ft so can't help you there - but I'd be willing to bet that no one is going to negative split a second lap of Hellgate :rolleyes:

Cheers, 2P

Edited by Twopennys, 24 March 2007 - 04:05 PM.


#40 Thomas

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Posted 24 March 2007 - 04:53 PM

Thanks 2P. As far as the time goes I guess we'll find out soon enough.

#41 milov

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Posted 26 March 2007 - 01:32 PM

hmmmm, the Clayton's Melbourne TW this year has left me a little unsatisfied.... Catching up with old friends in the Blue Mountains seems like it might help.

Please pencil me in


milov

#42 CoolwalkerDavid

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Posted 26 March 2007 - 08:05 PM

View PostThomas, on Mar 24 2007, 02:23 PM, said:

With the deviation camp ground is it just roll up and pitch a tent or is there a more formal process?

Also if in reality the Jenolan Jaunt is 6ft x 1.25, would I be right in saying that a 12 hour 12 foot would equate to more than 15hr hellgate? As a second lap of hellgate must be at least return 6ft x 1.45-2 (for arguments sake) as the return on 12 ft is easier than the first half but this is obviously not the case for Hellgate being a double loop?


Hi Thomas if you read last years 12 foot reports there were certainly no negative splits there that I can see

Spud's winning time being for example

12FT (Half splits)
5.06
6.06
Total=11.12

so I wonder if it is easier coming back overall - not that it really matters for the sake of this thread of course  :rolleyes:

all the best  David

and sorry 2p - I guess this would have taken me about 2 days anyway but I have already invested in plane fares and an entry at Coburg that weekend.

Edited by david newborn, 26 March 2007 - 08:11 PM.


#43 Thomas

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Posted 26 March 2007 - 09:50 PM

Hi David, yes I know that it's difficult to negative split 12 foot, but when I did it I definately found the return leg easier in terms of terrain, but obviously who've got the fatigue issues against you. This was my very point - with Hellgate it's no easier being a double loop and you've still got the fatigue issues.

#44 Run 2 Become

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Posted 03 April 2007 - 09:54 AM

Bump! <_< <_<

#45 Becky O

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Posted 03 April 2007 - 09:58 AM

Just wondering how many people are camping out the night before?

Also, never driven there before, how long would it take to drive there from the Eastern Suburbs approx?

Cheers
Becky

#46 tim

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Posted 03 April 2007 - 10:03 AM

and water.  Going through the Caves and with 2P's water drop there will be 2 places to get water?  So how much is everyone carrying?

#47 rodthehornet

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Posted 03 April 2007 - 10:30 AM

Becky,

If you allow 3 hours drive, you will be fine.  Early morning it will probably be closer to 2.5 hours.

Tim,

I am taking 2L camelbak and a bottle.  With 2P's water drops to fill up from, that should be fine.  Food is probably a bigger question for me.  Snakes and jelly babies only get me so far...

The Hornet

#48 tim

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Posted 03 April 2007 - 11:34 AM

I was thinking of just taking my 3L camelback.  I guess we can get chips and stuff at the caves.

I am a bit concerned about the bit on the map marked "No Trail"??

#49 Martin Dugdale

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Posted 03 April 2007 - 03:38 PM

I am planning on taking a 2 litre camelback and some muesli bars. But will probably camp there the night before with a greater food choice in the car.

#50 superflake

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  • Location:Manly, NSW

Posted 03 April 2007 - 04:47 PM

View Posttim, on Apr 3 2007, 11:34 AM, said:

I am a bit concerned about the bit on the map marked "No Trail"??

From memory earlier in the thread 2P said there was a bush bash part for about 500m above the caves to find a trail. Is that the area Tim?