6 replies to this topic

[Chelli]

I was wondering about doing some sprint training and weight training with high reps in my off season without bulking up too much. I believe this could improve my running efficiency as I am more of a natural distance runner and long stuff doesn't seem to make me run any faster over a set distance of 5km - 10km anymore also the weight loss doesn't cut it for me, for long runs as my BMI is around 19-20 as I am 173cm tall and 59 kilos in weight.

Threshold running and VO2max training doesn't seem to improve my racing ability either because I do alot of these sessions during the season as well. I believe I am limited to my speed factor over 800m, 1500m and 3000 metres which is why my times are no longer improving over 5-10km.

I think if I was to work on my all out speed endurance I would have better results over 5 and 10km and greater running efficiency as well. Due to the fact that I already run at high percentage of my 800m - 1km top speed over 5 and 10km.

When I have done a speed session on the road on the odd occasion I struggle to run 800m on the road in under 2:30 and my 1km in 3:10. Yet I can run as many as 6-10 1km reps in 3:15-3:17 without slowing down and with a 1 minute jog recovery. But I have never been able to run 1 kilometre all out in under 3 minutes on the road when I have timed myself. Yet I have been able to run 10km in around 3:23-3:26 per kilometre pace when I am in peak condition. Also my outright speed is OK too as I can run 100m in mid to high 12's and 400's in 57-59 seconds.

If anyone has any Ideas on how to improve my 800m to 1km speed runs. I would like to know as I believe this is the key to bring my times over 5 and 10km down?

My PBs on the track are 100m= 12.62, 200m= 26:72, 400m= 57:4, 800m= 2:16 1500m= 4:31, 3000m=9:24 5km on road =16:35 10km on road=33:54 Striders North Head 10km =34:00

[MizukiNoguchi]

Good logic Chelli, try some 300-600 reps with longish 3-5min recoveries, you can make them part of your normal interval sessions. Also, finish every session with strides up to 100m experimenting with blasting 30m at either start/middle/finish of each 100m. I think some people are blessed with natural speed up to 200m, some with natural aerobic ability and some with both, but i think it's impossible to run anywhere near maximum ability 300-600's without specific training, my guess is that this is the missing component to improving your 1km reps.

[Chelli]

AllysonFelix, on Nov 17 2007, 12:47 PM, said:

Good logic Chelli, try some 300-600 reps with longish 3-5min recoveries, you can make them part of your normal interval sessions. Also, finish every session with strides up to 100m experimenting with blasting 30m at either start/middle/finish of each 100m. I think some people are blessed with natural speed up to 200m, some with natural aerobic ability and some with both, but i think it's impossible to run anywhere near maximum ability 300-600's without specific training, my guess is that this is the missing component to improving your 1km reps.

Thanks for your information I will take this on board and work on it. It is a definate weakness I have and I can't seem to have the will to hurt myself in these lactic acid sessions. I can get lazy running these sessions and I run them too aerobic. As I believe I should be struggling to walk at the end of these sessions from the lactic acid and I hear of people crouching over and nearly vomiting at the end of the session.

[MizukiNoguchi]

You don't need to go to vomit level, you are training for 5-10km's not 400's, i'd be looking for more controlled running. Keep it comfortable, just work towards making 48sec 300's feel easy, start with 51's and improve slowly. For the 600's aim for 1.48's, looking foward to 1.42's. Use these shorter reps to help adapt to the pace you want for your 1km reps, you've already proven you can convert your 1km reps to solid 5/10km times.

[Chelli]

Thanks for the tip!

I guess I would need long breaks to recover from the efforts for 300's and 600's say 2 minutes for the 300's and 3 minutes for the 600's. I guess I maybe take a too short of a recovery to run my speed sessions well sometimes. I think I should try to run at a slightly higher velocity to get used of the pace of running at that speed without all out sprinting and having a longer recovery so I can recover more between fast bouts.

Edited by Chelli, 17 November 2007 - 05:44 PM.

[Rudolf]

I would in Your case focus on 2 factors :

1- the structure of the whole week, so the week is not causing overtraining, does NOT have any anaerobic stuff in it, does have proper stimulating session to keep improving aerobic factor , does have some session to keep working on pure speed
(upto 60metres, but not starting speed) and working on strenght and felxibility)

2- cruising speed of 200's, I cant help it I allways go back to Kratochivlovas system.
here Your 200mPB=26.7 seems to be a crucial point, this should get down to 24 initialy, so that the easy cruising 200's speed could be around 28s initialy.

I would suggest session of 200's, take as much recovery between repeats as You need, and run each with ease, thinking this is a 800-1500-3000m race, whatever the figure works best for Your mind.So run them in that style-form-technique, NOT in the sprinting technique. Keep recording the times whatevere they are, and as You stick with this week after week You should adapt to this cruising speed, it will become eqasier and will start speeding up on its own. Sio do not force the initial target of cruising 28s. let it come to You.


I would suggest week with 2 of 200's sessions and 2 of quality aerobic sessions (say 1 of 90 min and 1 of 60 min)
the rest of the week should be mainly recoveries easy runs and cross training.

[Chelli]

AllysonFelix, on Nov 17 2007, 01:11 PM, said:

You don't need to go to vomit level, you are training for 5-10km's not 400's, i'd be looking for more controlled running. Keep it comfortable, just work towards making 48sec 300's feel easy, start with 51's and improve slowly. For the 600's aim for 1.48's, looking foward to 1.42's. Use these shorter reps to help adapt to the pace you want for your 1km reps, you've already proven you can convert your 1km reps to solid 5/10km times.

I have been doing alot of 300's and 600's of late I have been doing one of these sessions once a week and I have been doing roughly 1 : 2 work rest ratio.

I feel my running is progressing well and I feel that I am running faster and more efficient whilst doing my threshold and long runs. Whilst doing these runs I am focussing on form and technique. The last run I did I managed to run 12 x 300 in 46-49 seconds per rep. The ones with the wind were in the 46-47sec range whilst the ones against the wind were in the 48-49 sec range. Recently I have been working on my knee lift, bounding drills and run throughs. I have noticed this has help me to running faster with less effort.

Edited by Chelli, 22 December 2007 - 01:16 PM.