10 replies to this topic

[smokin]

Good morning all, just wanted to seek some comments on an issue that is annoying me

I'm currently training for the Run Melbourne Half and finding Long Slow runs an issue. Actually even short slow runs! They just kill my knees.

Intervals and Tempo runs I can handle for without any issues -but as soon as I do a run at 30+seconds slower than my desired race pace, within a few kms I feel like a cripple. It's even happended on easy recovery runs! It feels like ITBS from what I've read, but as soon as I do a quick run, all the pain vanishes, both during and afterwards. Aside from the actual location of the pain, I don't seem to have any other symptoms of ITBS.

So, anyone else had this sort of problem? obviously I need to get my long runs up beyond the current 14kms, but I don't want to turn everything into a long tempo session.

[no idea]

Hi Smokin,

I am only new and have 'no idea', but I have experienced similar things. For the past month and a half or so I have tried training at a lower heart rate and therefore slower pace. my legs. knees, ankles... everything have been sorer than at my old pace. I am guessing it is to do with a different stride at a slower pace. I'd be interested in how you go. After about 180k at this pace I am starting to feel better

[serena]

Hi Smokin (love the name),

Two things that helped me with this when i started running longer and longer was 1. lose some weight, get the pressure off your knees (that may or may not apply in this case, for me it was about 6kilos that did the trick) and 2. get more miles in the legs, they do get used to it.

I also found it helped to throw on a pair of long 2xu pants (for compression) after a long run. I have no idea whether they "work" or not, but it helped my knees feel better.

Make sure you are having enough recovery, too, after the long run. Maybe for now you need a day before and a day after? I can now run the day after a long run with no problems but while I was building my distance I had to rest a little more.

Really its a case of trying a few different things to see what works for you. It does get better on the long run in the long run.

serena

[smokin]

Thanks for the replies, folks.

After this morning's slow run (knee started playing up after about 2 ks) I pulled up very tight through the glutes and ITB band, so I think that might be wear the problem stems from after all. Looks like I'm in for regular "fun" foam roller sessions to see if that helps as well.

You have more idea than you think, NoIdea, I think the change in stride mechanics at the slower pace is certainly contributing to the problem.

And I also think I need a rest day in between runs, Serena. Plus I'm wearing my Skins to work today - if anyone gets a giggle out of it (and I'm sure they will) I can also point out how cold it's starting to get in the mornings over here

[SlowDave]

I've always been plagued by knee problems, so my training for the MM last year was entirely based on not injuring myself. I never ran faster than 75% Max heart Rate on my long runs, which meant for a fair bit of walking as I live in a hilly area. But it got a lot of hours into the legs and no knee injuries (alright one but that was totally unrelated to the running).

[eastodlux]

i've found that i have to work hard to find a sweet spot as far as my pace is concerned - too slow and i feel like a lot of impact is going through my knees and ankles, too fast and i can't maintain it over the course of a longer run. at the moment my sweet-spot seems to be 6min/k, so not the fastest runs in the world but they're getting better. feels a lot better than when i started though, but i've lost 10kgs since i began running several months ago.

[littleblackpug]

Go to a good sports physio and get them to assess your quads, particularly VMO activation, then they can give you the best advice for which bits to stretch and which bits to strengthen. I would chance a guess that you are lacking VMO activation.

[Ben1]

smokin, on Apr 22 2009, 08:34 AM, said:

Thanks for the replies, folks.

After this morning's slow run (knee started playing up after about 2 ks) I pulled up very tight through the glutes and ITB band, so I think that might be wear the problem stems from after all. Looks like I'm in for regular "fun" foam roller sessions to see if that helps as well.

Spent two days at the physio last week for the same sort of symptoms. Tight glutes, hammies and calves. She spent 40 mins each time working my lower back followed with a deep tissue massage on Saturday..........much better today after 15km, no tightness or pain. She actually never laid a finger on my legs and even worked my upper back and shoulder which seems to have done wonders. Mentioned my calves would probably play a G minor they were that tight.
Most of all though gave me some very good stretches (yes Im lazy - will go out and run for 3 hours but too lazy to stretch for 10 mins!!) best thing I found though was a tennis ball under the foot whilst sitting and rolling it from the toes to the back of the heel with slight pressure.
Wearing full length skins for 2 days also may have helped.

Good luck.

[eastodlux]

One thing I've noticed is that as I pick up the pace, my posture and form starts to naturally improve - it's as though my body is seeking the most efficient alignment for the run. I'm going to start investing a lot more time and effort in working my core muscles and hope that this improves my form - and the strain my legs bear - in my runs.

Edited by eastodlux, 05 May 2009 - 08:26 PM.

[Rico]

I'm always confused by training programs telling me to run 30 seconds or whatever slower than marathon pace. My long distance pace is 5 min kms. Running faster than this is harder, but running slower than this is hard work too. 5.30 per km is awkward and unnatural, much harder than running at 5.00.

[RodN]

I agree that it sounds like stride technique at slower speeds otherwise it would not be so determined by pace. I certainly feel that once I hit my 5 to 10k pace it just 'feels right' and I feel like I'm flying it's just brilliant. When I run really slow its much more "jolty" but luckily not producing pain yet.

Check out the video on here: http://www.the-maste...nning-form.html

Its like the stride is very similar across the three speeds with just more pace of leg turnover which I think is the ideal technique (one that is the same no matter the speed).

So perhaps as well as physio some technique work or coaching/training to get the stride right (if that's the issue).