76 replies to this topic

[richardegg]

Hello all,

3.5 weeks ago I decided to get into shape once and for all and get down to a healthy weight; I was 91.8kg, am now 87.5kg. I am using the weight watchers pro points sytem. Current activity is upwards of 50k of running a week, plus 3-5 weight training sessions on the upper body (running is my lower body workout). Considering I am about a medium frame, I have worked out my 'best' weight to be 74.7kg (or thereabouts...). I am a 28 yo male, 177.2cm tall (or a shade under 5ft10in). What is the optimum BMI for a medium/long distance runner? if it helps I have a 85cm waist, and am currently a pear shape (bum and thighs are huge!). I have heard optimum BMI is about 21ish, which i think would be too light for my bone structure (works out at 67kg) (and my wardrobe! 30 inch pants cannot be found out west, unless you go to Big W or Jay Jays!)

Any thoughts?

[russell2pi]

I'm very interested in this too.

I keep losing weight even though I have stopped trying, being happy with my current weight in the middle of the BMI recommendations. It's actually a challenge to keep up with the hunger on long run day. I am 175 cm and slightly more muscular than average. I stopped trying at 77 kg, and took up running around the same time. Now I am 73 kg. I reckon 70 kg might be about right in the long run. (?) Currently I can only notice a small amount of subcutaneous fat around the hips but I suppose there is a thin layer all over as well as in the abdominal cavity plus muscle marbling.

Edited by russell2pi, 15 June 2011 - 09:53 PM.

[Bellthorpe]

You might find this article of some interest.

[MrUniqueName]

Bellthorpe, on 15 June 2011 - 10:00 PM, said:

You might find this article of some interest.

Wow, if my calculations are correct, I need to lose about 7 or 8kg... and I'm already quite slim.

[Jimmy4990]

If you eat no more than you need to perform strongly & you make the right food choices, (which is a topic within itself) your body will find its own optimum weight. My view for what it is worth. I am just a little taller than you, I run at about 75 but only because I dont have the discipline to run at 69/70 meaning 67/68 is probably where you need to be for best performance.

Edited by Jimmy4990, 16 June 2011 - 08:06 AM.

[Hook]

I can never seem to get close to my ideal weight always sit 7-8kgs more. I guess I like my beer and chips too much

[B+]

c2105026, on 15 June 2011 - 09:42 PM, said:

Hello all,

3.5 weeks ago I decided to get into shape once and for all and get down to a healthy weight; I was 91.8kg, am now 87.5kg. I am using the weight watchers pro points sytem. Current activity is upwards of 50k of running a week, plus 3-5 weight training sessions on the upper body (running is my lower body workout). Considering I am about a medium frame, I have worked out my 'best' weight to be 74.7kg (or thereabouts...). I am a 28 yo male, 177.2cm tall (or a shade under 5ft10in). What is the optimum BMI for a medium/long distance runner? if it helps I have a 85cm waist, and am currently a pear shape (bum and thighs are huge!). I have heard optimum BMI is about 21ish, which i think would be too light for my bone structure (works out at 67kg) (and my wardrobe! 30 inch pants cannot be found out west, unless you go to Big W or Jay Jays!)

Any thoughts?

This sounds like excuses and justifications to me.....

I'm 178cm and 68kg, my race weight is 61-63kg. I'm at 68kg cause I have been sitting on my arse for 6 weeks eating crap and making excuses about the weather etc as to why I haven't trained for a while. When I started training for endurance based stuff I was 79kg(15 years ago). I wear size 30 pants and live out west and shop at brand name stores such as Industrie and Glue. your bum and thighs compared to your waist may be your issue
BMI is irrelevant if your trying to be the best athlete you can be. It was designed many years ago for the joe average person. Its a bit like 220minus your age for max heart rate i.e. crap.
If you want to know if your in shape then stand in front of the mirror without clothes on and you will answer your own question. Go out and run a testing 5km you will answer your own question.

Train safe

[GrizzlyBear]

I am 182cm & 93kg which equates to BMI of 28.08 - overweight and just under obese.

According to this I need to lose 10kgs to get to 'normal'.

But reminds me of the conversation I had with a person over lunch leading up to a marathon as I ordered dessert.

When my friend asked "Should you be eating that?"

My reply was "I am trying to finish the race, not win it!"

Dave

[Jimmy4990]

B+, on 16 June 2011 - 08:50 AM, said:

This sounds like excuses and justifications to me.....

I'm 178cm and 68kg, my race weight is 61-63kg. I'm at 68kg cause I have been sitting on my arse for 6 weeks eating crap and making excuses about the weather etc as to why I haven't trained for a while. When I started training for endurance based stuff I was 79kg(15 years ago). I wear size 30 pants and live out west and shop at brand name stores such as Industrie and Glue. your bum and thighs compared to your waist may be your issue
BMI is irrelevant if your trying to be the best athlete you can be. It was designed many years ago for the joe average person. Its a bit like 220minus your age for max heart rate i.e. crap.
If you want to know if your in shape then stand in front of the mirror without clothes on and you will answer your own question. Go out and run a testing 5km you will answer your own question.

Train safe

I like yor style B+. Wish I had of said that. Recently raced in a field of high quality athletes. I was mid pack. One thing I noticed, stood out like Dogs Balls. As I watched the top 30 come the other direction their were very few, if any guys racing at 75kg's. All 62/68. Thin arms, small chests, slight hips but running really fast;).

[B+]

Jimmy4990, on 16 June 2011 - 02:00 PM, said:

I like yor style B+. Wish I had of said that. Recently raced in a field of high quality athletes. I was mid pack. One thing I noticed, stood out like Dogs Balls. As I watched the top 30 come the other direction their were very few, if any guys racing at 75kg's. All 62/68. Thin arms, small chests, slight hips but running really fast;).

Thanks mate, know I just got to get the running really fast part happening and all will be good with the world.

Train safe

[richardegg]

Ok, thanks for the advice y'all;

I looked at the article; 74.4 would be my inactive weight, meaning i'd need to be 63-65 to do the distance I would like to do.

I would be more than happy to diet/exercise all this away (i USED to be 137kg! 300 pounds!) .....about 7 months ago at 78kg I had an abdominoplasty and a brachioplasty due to excess skin on my arms and stomach that was, well, disgusting. I could conceiveably get back to 70ish and have no loose skin on my upper body, but I don't know how the skin will hold up on the butt, thighs and calves. There are no stretch marks, so that suggests it could all go back (on my arms and stomach there were!). Skin removal is out of the question - firstly, available funds were used on the upper body, secondly the plastic surgeon does not like doing lower body due to excess risk of infection, difficult recoveries etc.

In light of this advice I might re-set my weight watchers pro-points goal weight to about 65ish, see how we go and if I get to look emaciated (my upper body was looking awfully bony at 78kg, but hopefully weight training that area this time will help) or get sloppy loose skin i'll stop then.

[russell2pi]

The article's metric conversions seem to be incorrect.

110 lbs is not 56.2 kg, it's 49.9 kg. 5.5 lbs is not 2.296 kg, it's 2.494 kg.

So it's 49.9+(height-1.524)/0.025*2.296 .

With those numbers the calculations seem to match what's in the table.

[Jimmy4990]

c2105026, on 16 June 2011 - 07:40 PM, said:

Ok, thanks for the advice y'all;

I looked at the article; 74.4 would be my inactive weight, meaning i'd need to be 63-65 to do the distance I would like to do.

I would be more than happy to diet/exercise all this away (i USED to be 137kg! 300 pounds!) .....about 7 months ago at 78kg I had an abdominoplasty and a brachioplasty due to excess skin on my arms and stomach that was, well, disgusting. I could conceiveably get back to 70ish and have no loose skin on my upper body, but I don't know how the skin will hold up on the butt, thighs and calves. There are no stretch marks, so that suggests it could all go back (on my arms and stomach there were!). Skin removal is out of the question - firstly, available funds were used on the upper body, secondly the plastic surgeon does not like doing lower body due to excess risk of infection, difficult recoveries etc.

In light of this advice I might re-set my weight watchers pro-points goal weight to about 65ish, see how we go and if I get to look emaciated (my upper body was looking awfully bony at 78kg, but hopefully weight training that area this time will help) or get sloppy loose skin i'll stop then.

I have a close personal friend who has a similar weight loss transformation to yourself. Well done, congratulations. You are an inspiration.

[richardegg]

Jimmy4990, on 16 June 2011 - 08:39 PM, said:

I have a close personal friend who has a similar weight loss transformation to yourself. Well done, congratulations. You are an inspiration.

Thanks Well it hasn't all been plain sailing - here are some of the highlights and lowlights of the past 5 yrs of weight management

August 2006 - 137.4kg - heaviest ever.
Sept 3 2006 - commenced most successful weightloss program to date, 132.6
24 march 2007 - 88.5 - 24th birthday
1st July 2007 - 81.7 - began maintenance at suggestion of dietician
August 2007 - 1st C2S - 84.5kg
Oct 2007 - 87kg (binge eating due to addictive reasons)
xmas 2007 - 82kg
maintained until 2nd C2S (running weight 81kg), Aug 2008
Oct 2008 - 90kg (stress due to workplace bullying)
Easter 2009 - 78.5kg (went through a good patch of life relationship wise and socially)
September 2009 - 101kg (self destructive spiral due to imploding situations at work, home and socially, accompanied by high alcohol and tobacco consumption)
March 2010 - started new course and life at uni - 91kg
August 2010 - 92kg - booked in for abdominoplasty.
November 2010 - 77.9kg - week before surgery, did a crash shake-based diet with running up to 80km a week, no smoking.
January 2011 - festive season and lack of post-op activity brings weight up to 81kg
March-April 2011 - depressive relapse ceases running, sees smoking and binge eating come again - up to 92kg
Today - 87kg - C2S training combined with tobacco cessation and weight watchers online.

Hopefully I will never see my weight starting with a '9' ever again. Then 8. and maybe even 7.

[Jimmy4990]

Never stop trying to improve yourself

[B+]

c2105026, on 16 June 2011 - 07:40 PM, said:

Ok, thanks for the advice y'all;

I looked at the article; 74.4 would be my inactive weight, meaning i'd need to be 63-65 to do the distance I would like to do.

I would be more than happy to diet/exercise all this away (i USED to be 137kg! 300 pounds!) .....about 7 months ago at 78kg I had an abdominoplasty and a brachioplasty due to excess skin on my arms and stomach that was, well, disgusting. I could conceiveably get back to 70ish and have no loose skin on my upper body, but I don't know how the skin will hold up on the butt, thighs and calves. There are no stretch marks, so that suggests it could all go back (on my arms and stomach there were!). Skin removal is out of the question - firstly, available funds were used on the upper body, secondly the plastic surgeon does not like doing lower body due to excess risk of infection, difficult recoveries etc.

In light of this advice I might re-set my weight watchers pro-points goal weight to about 65ish, see how we go and if I get to look emaciated (my upper body was looking awfully bony at 78kg, but hopefully weight training that area this time will help) or get sloppy loose skin i'll stop then.

Mate good job on your successes to date. Its not any easy road to journey when doing nothing seems a lot easier. I'm sure you will achieve your goals given your dedication to your weight lose.
What is your "distance I would like to do"?
Aside from running your doing the right thing in working your body in the gym. Plenty of weight lose people target gross weight loss rather than net body fat loss. Keep training your muscles and you will be thinner and healthier with the ability to still do other stuff.

If you need some fashionable clothes let me know and I can arrange to ghet some sent to you from Penrith the nerve centre of the west;-)

Train safe

[Fire Horse]

c2105026, that is an effort in your journey to fitness and weight loss that I think will kick start quite a few people around you, into thinking "if he can do it, why not me?".  Massive kudos to you.

Re- the article in the link above - am I the only person who thinks this reads like an article written in the 1970s?!  Not a lot of evidence or considered reasoning to be had - it's pretty anecdotal for a piece of writing meant to persuade us to lose weight to be better runners.

- eg. the guy who went to Europe for a cycling tour for 2 months, and came back 16 sec faster in his mile event.  The author is convinced "that an ahlete's (sic) weight is something that neither coach nor athlete can ignore", based on the improvement in performance.  What about the training effects (cardiovascular and strength) of riding 100 miles/day for 2 months?  Why is the author not recommending we all take up cross-training on the bike? Instead he would recommend we all lose weight, based on his one-shot case study.

I'm also having some doubt about "Van Aaken's anatomical studies", where he concluded that there is little variation in the skeletal mass of people of the same height and gender.  This may be partly true, but we are not just skeletons while we are alive, and there is an enormous variation in the muscle mass of individuals.  Having worked in Radiology, I can attest that some people are very finely boned, and others have skeletons that would not look out of place on a bullock.  And the genetic programming and hormones etc. that produce this sort of variation, are also involved in producing the lightly- or heavily-muscled, and everything-in-between, bodies we see around us.  From this, I think the comment about skeletal mass is fairly irrelevant.  Some people are genetically programmed to be big, and others, small.

This article seemed to largely ignore other factors that contribute to how fast we can run, and for how long.  For example, I might be well down in the weight/height comparison, like all the cited champions, but have the lung capacity of a budgerigar; no matter how many kg I lose, or how I pimp my diet, I will never be a runner of note.  In truth, running performance for each of us as individuals is optimised by a number of factors, including (but not exclusive to) diet, power-to-weight ratio, technique and training.  In considering power-to-weight, there probably is a range for each of us that optimises our performance, but there is certainly no one-size-fits-all formulation here, where all people of a certain height should aim to be a certain mass.  And in the end, we only have one body to work with (donor organs not-withstanding) - and life's not just about running fast...

[richardegg]

B+, on 17 June 2011 - 04:41 PM, said:

Mate good job on your successes to date. Its not any easy road to journey when doing nothing seems a lot easier. I'm sure you will achieve your goals given your dedication to your weight lose.
What is your "distance I would like to do"?
Aside from running your doing the right thing in working your body in the gym. Plenty of weight lose people target gross weight loss rather than net body fat loss. Keep training your muscles and you will be thinner and healthier with the ability to still do other stuff.

If you need some fashionable clothes let me know and I can arrange to ghet some sent to you from Penrith the nerve centre of the west;-)

Train safe

when I say west i mean central west...of nsw.....lol...i am from orange.
As for distance.....to do an official marathon is on my bucket list. however, at the moment the 14.1k route i do for C2S training is plenty. I have attempted a 1/2 marathon (got a time of 2h 6m 30s), that was tiring to the point of being unenjoyable (although I was around 90kg when I did that). Not sure If i could have the 3-4 hr solid blocks a week for weekly long run for marathon training. as i get lighter i assume i will get more energetic, so will see how it goes. My main issue is that the C2S is my fave run; the sydney marathon is too close too it, and I feel that to have overlapping training schedules is too confusing. For now, the C2s would be about outright speed, where the marathon is outright survival.

[Davesabitslow]

Fire Horse, on 17 June 2011 - 09:25 PM, said:

and life's not just about running fast...

I agree completely. Life is not just about running fast - it's also about drinking. After running as fast as you can for as long as you can I've found that it's important to replenish your carb levels by drinking lots of beer. I guess that's why I can't get below 75kg despite running 80ks a week.

Not that I'm complaining, life's all about ying and yang (run and drink).

[Caterpillar]

According to
http://www.letsrun.c...?thread=1164007
the typical male elite marathoner has a BMI between 19 and 20, although there are probably a few outliers.
I've also heard that a 1kg loss of body fat will improve marathon times by 2 minutes....although I suspect it's hard to lose body fat without compromising muscle if one has a body fat percentage in the low single digits.

[russell2pi]

Caterpillar, on 18 June 2011 - 05:19 AM, said:

I've also heard that a 1kg loss of body fat will improve marathon times by 2 minutes....although I suspect it's hard to lose body fat without compromising muscle if one has a body fat percentage in the low single digits.

I imagine 1 kg loss of upper body muscle would have a similar benefit?

Certainly most people would need to lose a lot of upper body muscle to bring their physique into line with elite marathoners. Males at least.

[CountryMuzz]

Caterpillar, on 18 June 2011 - 05:19 AM, said:

I've also heard that a 1kg loss of body fat will improve marathon times by 2 minutes.....

I have just found my new goal - get myself down to a running weight of 15kg, and I am going to win one  

[CountryMuzz]

c2105026, on 15 June 2011 - 09:42 PM, said:

Any thoughts?

It depends why you are running. Is the goal to lose weight down to a target, or to be a runner? You say your goal is to run a marathon one day - I had the same dream, and can now say I have done it, but I was never a runner, or even fit until a few years ago. If you keep running 50k/wk, and doing some weights, and eating healthy - and you keep doing it consistently (every week) for a couple of year - trust me, you will trim down a lot more than 87kg. And if you can do that consistently for year or two, then you will find that you can run the half marathon distance without too much trouble - you would be doing it nearly every weekend for the pelasure of it.

From there, the step up to finishing a marathon is not as daunting as it seems. And you will find the time - because you will want to. Don't worry about the complications of race timeing - once you are training for your marathon, you will love running the C2S six weeks before hand (because you will be so much quicker than you are now).

Don't analyse your BMI, don't set a target weight, just get fit - run often, do it consistently, and just enjoy watching your transformation. You will find new pants in your size - they do exist - and you will enjoy finding them and buying them because will be fitter and trimmer than 99% of the other guys in your town.

You have already achieved something most people will never do - just keep going!

[richardegg]

Yes, I have heard of a model where it was calculated by physiologists that, assuming same levels of aerobic fitness and muscular stamina, reducing weight by 1kg improves running times by 2.7s/km. So me at 87kg now doing 14.1k city to surf in say 78 min, if i trimmed down to 67kg that would be a time of.....65 min. However I reckon all kilometres i'd do would improve running technique, strength, stamina so that'd come down further.

I run as a way to keep fit, as something to do, as a way to meet people, gives me a reason to travel, and as a way to set myself some new challenges that have minimal external interference.

[aDrain]

c2105026, on 17 June 2011 - 10:35 PM, said:

... was tiring to the point of being unenjoyable ...

Sounds like me at some stage of any race I've done

[Action]

aDrain, on 18 June 2011 - 05:45 PM, said:

Sounds like me at some stage of any race I've done

ditto

Simple physics says that reduce the weight being carried by 1% and the energy required to carry it reduces by a similar margin.  I know I am close to race weight when my mum says I look gaunt.  Don't you love mums?  My ideal BMI is about 20, and the height plus formula above is pretty spot on for me, and that is based on 30 odd years of running.  However, I do agree with the advice above of "just run".  Get the kms up and do it consistently and your weight will settle at the right point. The kms and your subconscious will get you there.  Consistency at a reasonable level is the key, for me is about 100k a week, but we are all different.

[Hamburglar]

I have had an interesting experience this year with weight. I am 180cm and have hovered around 72-74kg for the 5 years I have been running. This year, I specifically focused on trying to lose a few kg for the purpose of getting faster. I have focused on watching 1) what I eat 2) portion control. The changes to my diet would be very minor to the outsider but I have had to dig deep to tap any self control I have to achieve this. Mostly I fail, but sometimes I stay strong. Breaking habits is pretty hard I have found.

Over the past 3 months I have lost 3.5kg and am now 69.5kg. Over the period I have trained well, but nothing too much more than average. The result - PB's from 5k to Half. 46secs off 5k (18:04), 87 secs of 10k (36:43) and 45 secs of my half (83:08). Yes the training has been going relatively well, but I figure at least half of the running improvement would be definitely be down to weight loss. I reckon I could lose a few more as well.

Get thin to win!

Edited by Hamburglar, 18 June 2011 - 07:22 PM.

[walshy2]

Weight has so much of an impact on results.

Like Hamburglars story above I have seen the evidence of good training combined with weight loss

I am currently around 71kg's (165cm) and feel so sluggish carrying this weight around. My normal racing weight is 65 - 66kg, but llast July I got down to the lowest in my adult life (63.8kg) and although I looked quite gaunt and sickly was running fast and did my 1st ever sub 3 mara.

I wouldnt want to be that thin all the time as I had to cut out beer and food I enjoy, but the sacrifice for a goal race was worth it

[Ayla2010]

I have noticed my speed increase with my weight loss but I am sure that has to do with increasing my fitness too. I started running at over 100 kg (am only 158 cm tall) and am now just under 85 kg . I  am still quite slow (av pace 7:40 ish) slower for longer runs. I know once I've finished losing weight it will be easier.

[richardegg]

Action, on 18 June 2011 - 06:14 PM, said:

ditto

Simple physics says that reduce the weight being carried by 1% and the energy required to carry it reduces by a similar margin.  I know I am close to race weight when my mum says I look gaunt.  Don't you love mums?  My ideal BMI is about 20, and the height plus formula above is pretty spot on for me, and that is based on 30 odd years of running.  However, I do agree with the advice above of "just run".  Get the kms up and do it consistently and your weight will settle at the right point. The kms and your subconscious will get you there.  Consistency at a reasonable level is the key, for me is about 100k a week, but we are all different.

Me too - when i get down to 78ish mum, dad and all of the family friends start thinking that I look gaunt. Hence the weight training to give some tone and defenition to the upper body (not sure if i'm gaining any actual muscle mass atm)to distract the gauntness.

[russell2pi]

c2105026, on 19 June 2011 - 03:37 PM, said:

Me too - when i get down to 78ish mum, dad and all of the family friends start thinking that I look gaunt. Hence the weight training to give some tone and defenition to the upper body (not sure if i'm gaining any actual muscle mass atm)to distract the gauntness.

Out of interest, how tall are you?

I remember when I was 83 and went in the work weight loss comp... I received numerous "you don't have anything to lose" comments and in fact some of them were seriously cross when I won the comp!

It is amazing how people's perceptions of "normal" weight have increased over the years. I was well into the overweight BMI. For a person my height (175 cm), 65 kg is "gaunt" ... not 75-80 as so many today now seem to think. (In fact 80 is overweight unless you are very muscular.) I was probably guilty of the same thing until I became conscious of my middle age spread and decided to put a stop to it. Looking around now it seems that overweight people make up the vast majority of the population, particularly in the 30-70 age bracket.

[richardegg]

Exactly - 177.2cm, or 5ft 9.7 in.

The weight I need to be 'healthy' is apparently 78.5kg. Weight watchers will only allow me to go down to 62kg (BMI= 19.. As of this morning 87kg.

My friends and family all feel that I 'look good', as I am now, and my GP doesn't think I am at any health risk, but considering he used to go running in his younger days he appreciates that I may want to drop a bit for speed, stamina and asthetics. It is a sad fact that in terms of BMI, the BMI of 22.5 (found to be lowest mortality) for a 175cm man is a gaunt-ish 69kg. For me it is 70.6, a weight level that will prompt many to suggest i go into rehab for eating disorder.....whats more is that I fit a medium top and size 34/87 bottoms. Yet I am overweight. I reckon 71kg will get me into an extra small top and size 30/77 pants. I think people are more comfortable with a fuller figure due to poor discipline. It may well be all good for the media to portray obese/ovweweight people in a positive light but science, nature and biology are on the side of the skinny folk!

[Caterpillar]

Only 10% of men over the age of 40 have a BMI in the healthy weight range of 18.5 to 25.

Below a BMI of around 21, blokes do start appearing rather gaunt, and whilst I'm not in that class, I hear people saying how 'unhealthy' they look, right to their face. I don't see people doing the same to the overweight and obese, where there ARE increased risk factors for a variety of ailments.

I guess it's not PC to tell a fatty about the risks of being fat, but the rule doesn't seem to apply to the thin but very healthy. I put it down to ignorance and, as has been mentioned, a sad shift in society's expectations on what 'normal' weight really is.

[Bellthorpe]

c2105026, on 19 June 2011 - 05:26 PM, said:

It is a sad fact that in terms of BMI, the BMI of 22.5 (found to be lowest mortality) for a 175cm man is a gaunt-ish 69kg.

Keep in mind that doesn't mean that 22.5 is the lowest mortality risk for you.

[russell2pi]

c2105026, on 19 June 2011 - 05:26 PM, said:

It is a sad fact that in terms of BMI, the BMI of 22.5 (found to be lowest mortality) for a 175cm man is a gaunt-ish 69kg. For me it is 70.6.

I think you will be surprised as you keep dropping weight, just how much fat you can lose while still bearing noticeable flab.

I stopped trying to lose weight when I took up running at 77 kg, but am now down to 73. The whole time I have looked in the mirror and thought "bah, there's barely anything there, surely 1 more kilo and the flab will all be gone". That's still the case - there is still visible flab and presumably the downward trend will continue for at least a few more kilos. I don't think I've become "gaunt"- to me that implies muscle loss. If anything I have gained muscle mass (weight training). Certainly they are stronger now and much more defined.

To put it this way, take two people, one who your mum would say is gaunt and one who she thinks looks healthy. Then get them to take their tops off. I bet she'd change her mind then about which one is healthy.

If you really want 'gaunt', look at someone like Mona, 176 cm and 60 kg. I reckon I can comfortably manage being 10 kilos heavier and not gaunt!

Edited by russell2pi, 19 June 2011 - 06:31 PM.

[run2work]

russell2pi, on 19 June 2011 - 06:30 PM, said:

If you really want 'gaunt', look at someone like Mona, 176 cm and 60 kg.

Does Mona think he is gaunt? A nice sort of fast 'gaunt'. I wouldn't mind some of that!
r2w

[richardegg]

I have heard that male endurance athletes have maybe 7-10% body fat. I have no idea what mine is - scales say about 22% but the measurement is not consistent. anyways even the 65kg/177cm marathon champ would still therefore have 5-7kg body fat on him.

[B+]

c2105026, on 19 June 2011 - 10:14 PM, said:

I have heard that male endurance athletes have maybe 7-10% body fat. I have no idea what mine is - scales say about 22% but the measurement is not consistent. anyways even the 65kg/177cm marathon champ would still therefore have 5-7kg body fat on him.

This is probably about right, however the elite runners are closer to 4-6% range and the women are getting into the 7-11% range. Keep in mind that whislt your body fat levels below your skin are all that gets measured, we carry large amounts of fat between our organs and other parts of our internal anatomy and this is used for various bodily functions. So in essence we are still carry kgs of fat even when we are measured as very lean.

A good mate of mine says he always knows when he is getting in to race shape cause his wife starts commenting that he has no arse and is looking scrawny.
Many years ago when I was in a very lean period and had sunken cheeks etc going on leading into a race. I had a lady at a work function comment to me that I looked like Tom Hanks out of Philadelphia, when I replied "thank you, is that before or after he had aids" she looked rather stunned and wasn't sure what to say and departed rather quickly. (story will only have relevance to those who saw the movie at the time)

I say to people that I'm not guant its just other people are actually chubby

Train safe

[chrizz84]

I have started eating heaps as i dont want to look to skinny and i still cant keep the weight on.every one asks if im eating well and it anoys me a typical meal would be 500 grm of meat + potatoes and pasta etc and im still losing at kg a month and at 180 cm tall and 68 kg i dont want to lose to much more

[DiJ]

Based on the calculations in the table for me at 5'4" and 62.5kg to get to my ideal racing weight I need to lose 20kg!  Gaunt would not be the word for me and I know my Mum would be stressed to the max thinking all of a sudden I had anorexia as would everyone else about the place.  I think I was probably 10 when I last weighed that much and I don't like starvation so for me I'm happy to stay a slow middle of the packer, although I really would like to lose about 7kg but I haven't been that light either since my 20's.  Food for thought though but no matter how much I run I've never gone under 60kg, I probably just like eating as much as I like running.

[richardegg]

Yeh,I am one of those people who when they actually eat something they gain weight. Obesity runs in the family on my fathers side. I am in the camp that says that genetics actually contributes to a significant proportion of the obesity we see. So, I must watch what I eat, and exercise a crapload.

Here is a thought; a 'typical' runners BMI of 20ish actually puts someone at the same BMI as someone like jim morrison, kieth richards, mick jagger - they may be gaunt but in their prime they got the women!

[maryclaire]

B+, on 20 June 2011 - 08:37 AM, said:

This is probably about right, however the elite runners are closer to 4-6% range and the women are getting into the 7-11% range.

... and are no longer menstruating and are at increased risk of osteoporosis.  

.

[Ponytail]

Obviously, if you wanted to run at an elite level you would require that "death camp" hollow stare as the elites do.  I think the rest of us want our weight to remain in a healthy range that's strong enough to help us to run as much as want to, but not heavy enough to impede us.  I have been in the BMI of 19 and looking back I looked like a lollypop freak.  Not what I would want now, but I definitely think we should all aim to remain within a healthy BMI.  If, due to muscle mass, the numbers on the scale put you outside of that but you can see you aren't carrying excess weight, then I wouldn't worry.  I now have ditched the scales and let my clothes do the talking - they're the first to let you know when you've dropped/gained at all.

I would suggest sticking to your current plan until you achieve your weight loss goals and then, once you have built the base, maybe focus on longer distances...after all, you've got the rest of your life ahead of you (and it should be a longer one now!)

[B+]

maryclaire, on 20 June 2011 - 07:28 PM, said:

... and are no longer menstruating and are at increased risk of osteoporosis.  

.

TRUE..... I have always maintained that there is much less correlation between being fit and being healthy than many people presume.

Some of the fittest athletes on the planet aren't all that healthy. So the trick is finding the blance that works for you as an individual.

Train safe

[JXT]

walshy2, on 18 June 2011 - 07:30 PM, said:

Weight has so much of an impact on results.

Like Hamburglars story above I have seen the evidence of good training combined with weight loss

I am currently around 71kg's (165cm) and feel so sluggish carrying this weight around. My normal racing weight is 65 - 66kg, but llast July I got down to the lowest in my adult life (63.8kg) and although I looked quite gaunt and sickly was running fast and did my 1st ever sub 3 mara.

I wouldnt want to be that thin all the time as I had to cut out beer and food I enjoy, but the sacrifice for a goal race was worth it

I agree about not wanting to be that thin all the time (and my wife hates it when I drop under 70kg). I'm 178cm and have never weighed more than 77kg, but when I am running a lot (bloody cold aside I was on for a 650km month) I get down under 65kg. Personally I feel physically strongest at around 70-72 and start to feel a bit fragile at my current 64.2. When I was a teenager (same height) I played basketball and a coach at the AIS suggested 76kg was my ideal weight for that sport and for my body at that age. I've always kept that in mind, and generally I still feel healthy at that weight, but can't eat enough to weight that much when I'm running 90-150km a week.

Great thread BTW and congrats c2105026 on the weight loss and health kick. I'm in awe of people like you. I'm from a family of obese people and it drives insane they won't do anything about it. And they feel the need to find fault with a poor skinny bloke like me.

[richardegg]

Yes, Today, without losing any actual weight (i actually gained 0.5kg in fluid somehow), I slashed 4m 3s off my 14.08k time....somehow...i don't know (new record/pb is 73m 47s - the fastest C2S type distance outside of the C2S itself.) perhaps the flat course sprinting I am doing with my club AND the hillwork I do on the treadmill in the gym is paying off....

I was a fat kid before it became fashionable. My first diet was when I was 10, my first visit to a dietician was when I was 11 and at the age of 12 I had tried weight watchers...the bullying at primary school was horrendous. I am by far the slimmest out of my immediate family; my brother and dad are still 'obese' but they are at least no longer 'morbidly' so; I have inspired them (dad at least) to change their lifestyles somewhat. My brother found a partner who could cook healthy food for him and give him a kick up the arse to do some exercise lol.....

[dave1678]

DiJ, on 20 June 2011 - 12:49 PM, said:

Based on the calculations in the table for me at 5'4" and 62.5kg to get to my ideal racing weight I need to lose 20kg!  Gaunt would not be the word for me and I know my Mum would be stressed to the max thinking all of a sudden I had anorexia as would everyone else about the place.  I think I was probably 10 when I last weighed that much and I don't like starvation so for me I'm happy to stay a slow middle of the pack going to try and eat well packer, although I really would like to lose about 7kg but I haven't been that light either since my 20's.  Food for thought though but no matter how much I run I've never gone under 60kg, I probably just like eating as much as I like running.

This is for runners seeking to win races. Running needs to fit in with the rest of your life.
I am 1.86cm (6'1)and 70kg atm and my wife thinks I look great which means I'm carrying too much weight for performance. I used to say 69Kg was my optimum weight but after my last 24hr race I dropped to 66 and was flying. I know I can run really well at 70kg too so I'm just going to try and eat well.

[Ponytail]

c2105026, on 21 June 2011 - 10:48 PM, said:

Yes, Today, without losing any actual weight (i actually gained 0.5kg in fluid somehow), I slashed 4m 3s off my 14.08k time....somehow...i don't know (new record/pb is 73m 47s - the fastest C2S type distance outside of the C2S itself.) perhaps the flat course sprinting I am doing with my club AND the hillwork I do on the treadmill in the gym is paying off....

I was a fat kid before it became fashionable. My first diet was when I was 10, my first visit to a dietician was when I was 11 and at the age of 12 I had tried weight watchers...the bullying at primary school was horrendous. I am by far the slimmest out of my immediate family; my brother and dad are still 'obese' but they are at least no longer 'morbidly' so; I have inspired them (dad at least) to change their lifestyles somewhat. My brother found a partner who could cook healthy food for him and give him a kick up the arse to do some exercise lol.....

I really feel for you c2106026 - I see overweight kids and my heart breaks for them because I was one of the mean kids who teased them when I was a kid.  I came from a home where vegetables were on the menu (despite the fact I hated them) every night.  As I grew up I understood the importance of nutrition because of that.  While I hated my parents for forcing me to eat my veg every night, I now thank them and I'm going through the same thing with my kids.

Bad nutrition is a cycle which needs to be broken, so good on you for breaking it.  Now you have made the break, spread the word...you have born the brunt of being an overweight kid, don't let your kids go down that road.

Congrats on the improvement to date and just give it time - if you believe in yourself it will happen, just don't push too hard too soon.

[theturtle]

c2105026, on 21 June 2011 - 10:48 PM, said:

Yes, Today, without losing any actual weight (i actually gained 0.5kg in fluid somehow), I slashed 4m 3s off my 14.08k time....somehow...i don't know (new record/pb is 73m 47s - the fastest C2S type distance outside of the C2S itself.) perhaps the flat course sprinting I am doing with my club AND the hillwork I do on the treadmill in the gym is paying off....

I was a fat kid before it became fashionable. My first diet was when I was 10, my first visit to a dietician was when I was 11 and at the age of 12 I had tried weight watchers...the bullying at primary school was horrendous. I am by far the slimmest out of my immediate family; my brother and dad are still 'obese' but they are at least no longer 'morbidly' so; I have inspired them (dad at least) to change their lifestyles somewhat. My brother found a partner who could cook healthy food for him and give him a kick up the arse to do some exercise lol.....

Good for you!  Keep going. One thing I have found with running is that you can actually achieve a lot more than you ever thought possible....with a good running plan, good nutrition and a few mates around you for positive encouragement.  Best wishes.

[richardegg]

Yes ponytail; I am very much single atm so kids are not on the horizon - but, I am embarking on a career in primary school education (as teacher) 2.5 yrs of course to go. I will declare as big a war on childhood fatness in my classroom/school as the department of education policies will allow me to do. Maybe I can give a lesson on what happens when you don't eat right; i could bring in my fat clothes and everything lol...