22 replies to this topic

[Bart Simpson]

I'm a regular runner with a long history of achillies and knee injuries. I was prescribed orthotics over a year ago and suffered continuously from blisters and my shoes became very 'sloppy' after about a month of running in them - (I run in the Adidas supernova control). After no difference with getting them adjusted etc, i was asked to try just a arch support insole which i slipped into my shoe after taking the original one out... and still the same problems... blisters and wonky feet feeling! Can anyone relate to this and/or can anyone recommend any ideas? Lately I am just running in the original shoe with a very shallow heel raise and it is nice and comfy but i am getting niggles back in my knees and achillies areas. Help me please!!

[miners]

Hi road queen - I was issued orthotics a few years ago and have slowly slipped out of the habit of wearing them (hadn't worn them for 18months). However, wthe recurrence of a niggling achilles injury a couple of months ago, I started wearing them again to give my heel some lift. The main difference is I've been putting the orthotic "underneath" the standard inner sole that comes with the shoe.

Now I'm sure this is the wrong thing to do, but the added height for my heel has cured my achilles injury - plus I don't get the common orthotic blistering problem because the inner sole gives the shoe a comfy fit without the protruding angles of the orthotic. Might be worth a try, but as I said, it's probably not the right thing to do.

[wunforfun]

roadqueen

I have always been diagnosed as an overpronator and was given custom orthotics and heavy motion control shoes, but still had ongoing knee, hip and shin injuries.

Now I run in cushioned neutral shoes, very shallow orthotics and have no injury problems, but had some initial soreness in the knee and hips while adjusting to them.

Hope this helps ;)

[Blue Dog]

I cannot believe the number of runners using orthotics. Have a close read of the previous posts. Do you think orthotics helped these runners?

Has anyone ever been for a diagnosis and been told "you don't need orthotics"?

It's rather like dropping your car in for a check-up. Spare me. B)

[MPHinLondon]

I used to do what minersrun does and put my orthotics under the inner of the shoe, my podiatrist nearly had a heart attack when I told her I'd been running for 4 months like that, I don't do that anymore.

I have really wide feet, big/high, hard orthotics and I have no problems. I run with Asics Gel Kayono and never had a single issue with mine, but what I do, is place the orthotic on top of the inner, draw around it, and then cut the back section of the inner out, then just ram the orthotic up against the front section of the inner inside the runners, and throw the back part I cut out away.

I can't tell you how much it hurts to do this to new runners, but it's the only way I get to run with such scaffolding under my feet without problems. If I didn't have orthotics there is no way I'd be able to do my mileage without getting the leg issues I used to on half the distance.

Edit: I'm sure you can train/strengthen your body to run without orthotics, I just don't have the time.

[dcl]

Blue Dog,

My orthotics have certainly helped me. Before having them I used to get alot of injuries that were related to overpronation. Since I started using them I've had no major problems.

When I selected a podiatrist for an opinion I chose a guy who had a record of being conservative when recommending orthotics. Of four people I known who've used him, I'm the only one for whom he has definitely recommended orthotics. He is a previous elite runner, so maybe that makes a difference.

dcl

[expozay]

I'm also going to go out on a limb (actually, both limbs) and state that orthotics have assisted me. I have overly flexible ligaments and no amount of strengthening will take away from the reality that the ligaments are not going to hold everything properly in place when pounding away on the pavement. Strenghtening may cut it for some people, but is of only limited use in someone like me.

Prior to having orthotics, I got bursitis, followed by sciatica, followed by calcaneal pain, followed by tender achilles.

Go and see a good podiatrist, find out if they are necessary for you, and, if so, make sure your shoes are then suitable for the orthotics. Getting the right advice and the correct support for your feet can make the world of difference.

[Ralph Wiggum]

Had a 'soft' orthotic for around 20months and had continual problems including the blistering and knee problems. Had it adjusted with little if any difference. Sought an alternate opinion from a different podiatrist and had a new 'rigid' orthotic designed and its been much better. Incidentally I also wore Adidas S'nova Controls and quite liked them.

[RunSammieRun]

I have been running for many years now. In late 2003 I developed an acute pain on the outside of knee - so bad that I could hardly walk let alone run. I saw my local sports doc/podiatrist who discovered that my left leg is slightly shorter than my right and that my pain was severe ITB strain. He prescribed me an orthotic for my left foot only.

I have run with the orthotic ever since then and have never had the pain in my knee return whilst wearing it. If I run in a pair of shoes without the left orthotic the knee pain returns (usually within the first km of the run). I wear it under the shoe's inner sole and have never had a problem with blisters etc. I wear ladies Asics Kayanos.

I do not fully understand why at the ripe old age of 25 my body suddenly decided to get upset about the leg differences. The doc told me that I was getting old and that more of these sort of things could crop up - GREAT!! <_<

[EatEm]

Another convert,

When I ran 20 + years ago I started getting knee pain after 8 - 9 kms ... so eventually I just gave up running.
When I restarted running in Oct 2003 knee pain returned. A trip to a specialist and a hard set of orthotics followed. I only use them when I run but no knee problems at all. Some minor rubbing on the edge of the orthotic - that is all.

I run in Gel Kayano X & XI - remove the inner sole, trim the raised edging and place back into shoe. By trimming the edging it helps the othotic 'sit' properly in the shoe.

We want you back on the road 'road queen'.

[Stumpy]

Orthotics - great, if made properly for both you and your shoe.

I have had orthotics for years, just as a kid at school playing sport i had to get them, i have very very flat feet. It fixed it fine. Over the years i have had achilles problems and plantar fasciatis (plus a tear of the plantar fascia) and ortho have fixed them all. I have achilles tendinosis and calf tendinitis in both legs, and after therapy ad injections, a new pair of orthos which stopped the rotation of my ankle joint fixed it, made it more stable.

With my plantar fascia, after 6 mths of therapy, 2 cortisone injections, a new pair of orthos again fixed it within 4 weeks - that was a tear.

I have the same problem now, not quite a tear, but similar, a slight adjustment to the orthos last week have just about fixed it. My foot has changed over the past 2 yrsm so changes have to be made.

I know a lot of bad pods - giving out wrong orthos, not making them correctly, letting them slip in the running shoes - blisters etc. But if they are done correctly, they work great.

[Blue Dog]

Stumpy, you are an interesting case study.

Without wishing at all to offend, you have certainly had many injuries during your long-term use of orthotics.

Aren't they meant to prevent these types of injuries? Would a better suited shoe have assisted?

Just food for thought. B) :)

[Colac]

If I was having so much trouble with orthotics, I would seriously look closely at BAREFOOT walking and running on grass surfaces, and actively campaign for others to join me, and set up our races.

[kumar]

Guys i have flat fleet too and I seem to be suffering from chronic ITB (while hiking or running)... I tried couple of mouldable soles, but it didn't help..

I was planning to go for orthotics... But lot of people seem to be suggesting strengthening exercises instead of orthotics.. Also from the posts here, It seems orthotics is not a cure all - panacea... How do one know how is a good podiatrist?

I have recently got a NIKE Free shoe to see if it would help..

Kumar
Oregon, US

[Stumpy]

Blue Dog: orthos are far from causing these injuries. There are so many different types of orthos.

I had them, i got injured, so they were adjusted. If you have the correct type of ortho , they will prevent injuries. But, for example, why, originally, would they have made an ortho for me that would have stopped the rotation in the joint of my ankle to stop me getting tendinosis - it would have been totally unnecessary - kind of like looing into the future. Same with the fasciatis - why would they have made them for that without knowing it is a problem.

Its all well and good to say that after the fact

[lonecruiser]

Hi guys,

Have to agree a bit with blue dog on this one. My experience only - had orthotics prescribed about 10 years ago for recuring severe achillies tendinitis. They sort of worked although when you take 8 weeks off at the same time its hard to say which one was the cure.

After 18 months I finally got tied of the blisters and poor fit as well and discarded the orthotics, gave up touch football and increased my running to at least 3-4 runs per week. Haven't look back. Whilst I have still had the occasional overuse injury, that is exactly what I put them down to now. If you stress your body too much without adequate rest trouble is not far away.

I'm sure some people DO need orthotics for biomechanical problems, but not all running injuries need orthotics - but once you get to a podiatrist - there is not much else they can prescribe. I would suggest considering other causes of injuries and leave orthotics as a last resort.

Cheers,
lonecruise

[Bart Simpson]

Thanks guys, that has given me a lot to think about. It's a difficult one, as i am known to push myself in training, and i am getting back into daily running after 18months off!(but am taking it slowly!); then again i just don't want to take the chance doing the mileage in shoes that may, eventually, aggrevate my legs once again.
dcl.... can you advise me on the podiatrist you saw? I'm interested to know the difference between the 'soft' and 'rigid 'ortho.
Blue Dog.... I have always agreed with your opinion on orthos - thus the reasoning for my doubts - but i'm just so sick of getting sore all the time!!!

[southy]

I went several years ago to a podiatrist for an assessment for orthotics. It costs me over $500 and I still can't wear them. They are far too rigid to run in and caused other foot problems even walking in them. I finally gave up and went to another podiatrist for an assessment a couple of years ago. He sold me some orthotics that he heat molded in my shoe with my foot in them for about $200 (including the assessment). They work much better. Not perfect but they are much better. My main complaint with them is that they are very hard and so I have to be careful about stress fractures in my feet now. I would try strengthening exercises, more stable shoes, and even over the counter orthotics before I invested in custom orthotics. As you can see I'm not impressed by them, although I know some people who swear they can't run without them.
And yes, I had run for over 15 years without needing orthotics , but age and two pregnancies seemed to take its toll on my feet eventually.

[PodRunner]

Here we go again...

Yes there are many people who do not need orthotics, and yes, there are also many people who benefit to varying degrees from orthotics ranging from flexible up to rigid(only very occasionally, and rarely for runners). Some runners, like myself, would not be able to run pain free without them.
For those who require them, orthotics should be seen as customization of shoes which are mass produced for the general population.

Correctly fitting orthotics is as much an art as it is a science. Anyone can put a plastic or rubber block under your foot to hold it to the correct position if you over/under-pronate. Making it comfortable enough to run on, and at the same time have the desired effect is the art.

This topic has been discussed at length before, with the fairly common agreement being that if you are going to see a podiatrist, make sure he/she is a runner.

Now I'll sit back and wait for Bellthorpe's witty attack ;)

[pronator]

Hi road queen,

I have just started wearing some ready-made orthotics (the brand is "Vasyli"), but I am wondering whether there will be any noticeable benefit over time or whether it will present more problems.

About a week ago I was recommended by my physio to try a pair of orthotics to assist with a number of problems including pain under my left arch, flat feet and ITB (left side). Last year a podiatrist recommended custom-made orthotics but I didn't want to fork out that much money for something that I wasn't convinced would help or that I would persist with. So when my physio suggested I try some ready made ones which cost $65 I thought it was worth a try. I am still getting used to them by walking in them mainly. However last week I ran in them 2 days consecutive, and found that I was getting pain in my right leg, around the front of the ankle and in the achilles. The left side left ok, quite comfortable infact. So it was almost like I need the orthotic for the left but not for the right.

Not sure what to do.....

I am not running with the orthotics in at the moment, but it is kind of like a catch-22 situation. Without the orthotic, my left arch continues to give me pain. With the orthotic, I can't really run at all because of the introduced pain. It also feels like I have bricks tied to my feet. Maybe I just need to get used to them. :unsure:

[Craig the pod]

[indent]quote:

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'For those who require them, orthotics should be seen as customization of shoes which are mass produced for the general population.

Correctly fitting orthotics is as much an art as it is a science. Anyone can put a plastic or rubber block under your foot to hold it to the correct position if you over/under-pronate. Making it comfortable enough to run on, and at the same time have the desired effect is the art.'

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[/indent]Well said Andy!
A lot of people report that they have been to a podiatrist and they are told that they need orthotics. I prefer to discuss the how much the individual may benefit from an orthotic- some people will find a massive benefit, others it may be more subtle. The consistent thing is that there should be no negative effect.
As Andy said, it is definately an art... sometimes an orthotic will be perfect first time, and other times not... what you need to find is a Podiatrist who can work with you and find the best solution.
If your orthotics are painful, feel hard or awkward, then they are not working properly. They should also not take months to get used to. A good Podiatrist understands that there may be adjustments and will not charge for review appointments. They should also be able to most adjustments on site.
Appropriate exercises may also be prescribed which generally work together with the orthotic to provide to best solution. You may get excellent results from exercises alone, but often the time taken to see this result is quite protracted... most people who come to see me want to get better sooner rather than later!
As for off the shelf orthotics, they are not the same as custom... they can be some help, but they are a compromise on level of support, stability, and specificity.
Unfortunately there will always be those who have bad experiences with orthotics, just like there you find those who have bad experiences with Chiros, Physios, Docs etc...

Just my 2c worth!
Cheers
Craig

[Bart Simpson]

very interesting southy! I have also run for about 15 years without the problems i have now since i have had 2 children! Could there be a link with feet structure/ arches changing due to pregnancies???? :unsure:

[PodRunner]

Hi Road Queen and Southy,

Yes, pregnancy can have a big impact on the feet. Your body releases a hormone called relaxin to prepare you for childbirth, which can affect more than just the relevant ligaments.
It's impact on the feet can cause them to flatten significantly, and many women report these symptoms when they've never experienced foot/ankle/knee/hip/lower back pain before.