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Top Ten NSW distance runners in history


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#1 Long Arms

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Posted 24 December 2004 - 09:41 PM

I have had several discussions about who the top NSW runners in history are(3km up to untra-marathons) are. We have had several world class performers in distances from 3000m up to the marathon.

I would be interested to know who you think are the TOP TEN male distance runners from NSW in history. Maybe we can do one for the females some other time, with Kerryn McGann, Liz Miller and Tanni Ruckle coming immediately to mind.

My top ten males, with major career highlights,  are:

1. Alby Thomas (world 2 miles and 3 miles records; also ran the 4th fastest mile in history in 1958).

2. Al Lawrance (3rd in 1956 Olympic 10000m final).

3. Dave Power (3rd in 1960 Olympic 10000m final

4. John Farington (won 3 City To Surfs, won Fukuoka, pb 2.11)

5. Andrew Lloyd (won Commonwealth Games 5000m in 1990, 5000m pb of 13.24, won 4 City To Surfs)

6.John Andrews (6th in World Half Marathon Championships in 61.30, 27th in World XC, 10000m pb of 28.08 and 5000m pb of 13.27)

7.Lawrie Whitty (winner of 4 international marathons, Australian XC winner, Commonwealth Games finalist)

8. Scott Westcott (2.13 marathoner- twice in 2004, Australian XC Champion)

9. Paul Arthur (Winner of City To Surf, member of record Ekiden Relay team, multiple place getter at National XC, ranked 15th in World in 1992 for Half Marathon in 62.15)

10. Jamie Harrison (winner of four Australian 10000m titles in a row, 5000m pb of 13.27, 30th in World Cross Country Championships).

*Other notables Dave Evans, Kim Gillard, Rob McDonald, John Young, Mr G)


Arms

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#2 nvrgvup

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Posted 24 December 2004 - 10:17 PM

Scott westcott and Andrew Lloyd have to be in there

#3 Slick

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Posted 24 December 2004 - 10:39 PM

Although I'm not from NSW - I'd put Dave Power higher than Al Lawrence. Power did the 6 mile/Marathon double at the 1958 Commonwealth games! - given the fact that Zatopek did the distance treble only 6 years earlier (at Helsinki O.G) - I feel Power's achievement has been underated!

#4 Colac

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Posted 25 December 2004 - 10:14 AM

Hard to say who was best, but Alby Thomas was awesome at the time with such great running over two and three miles for his world marks.

#5 Long Arms

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Posted 25 December 2004 - 10:40 PM

Albie is an absolute legend internationally; great to see him recover well from his heart operation and continue to coach the Dragon (St George)juniors.

Arms

#6 Stu Mac

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Posted 27 December 2004 - 10:02 AM

Some very intersting names, I do believe that we could see more of  Scott Westcott , turns 30 next year and is probably about to hit is 'prime' years and will be hoping to make some Aussie teams in 2005-2008, should see him move up the order of precedence.

#7 Long Arms

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Posted 27 December 2004 - 11:21 PM

I agree. I believe that Scott has an even quicker marathon in his legs. Hopefuly we will see him wear the green and gold in some major championships. Could be at his prime for Melbourne 2006 and Beijing 2008. Marty Dent is one who didn't quite make the list but who has the potential to be our next Deek. His 2.15 at 2004 Canberra Marathon was simply awesome, backed up by anoither 2.15 at Chicago (was on 2.12 pace most of the way). He is still only young so watch out for Marty.

#8 DrJH

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Posted 28 December 2004 - 08:44 PM

Why limit it to between 3k and the marathon? If you include 1500 it strengthens arguments for Thomas, Lloyd and myself as winners of stste 1500/mile.

I'd rank Lloydy ahead of Farrington anyway, mainly on track performances.

My win/loss record against the three ahead of me is pretty good! Lawrie has the advantage of having been to the Commonwealth games.

Are we taking much notice of half marathon times on a downhill course?

Lloyd, Andrews and myself have won Zatopeks.

I'd be interested in seeing some more arguments as to why Arthur and Westcott should be ahead of me.

I'd probably put Danny Boltz in front of them.

#9 Alf Tupper

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 05:24 PM

Jamie,

I agree you shoudl be higher. I remember seeing your results in the UK and they were good too.

What about Youcef Abdi - Commonwealth Bronze!

#10 Long Arms

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 05:35 PM

Jamie,

It is certainly very subjective comparing athletes from different eras; eg Thomas v Westcott. On comparing Harrison v Arthur v Westcott it is a little easier, although still a very difficult task. When I ranked you guys I placed the heaviest weighting on International class performances, followed by national class performances, and barely looked at state level performances as you guys are all well and truely national/international level runners.
If it was just based on state level performances then it would be Arthur, followed by Harrison, then Westcott (Arthur has won the most NSW gold medals over quite a wide range of events- 5000m track up to marathon, including numersou cross country and road titles).

If it was on a range of talents, then I would pay Westcott (1500m pb of 3.46...same as Harrison, up to marathon of 2.13...much better than Arthur and Harrison), followed by Harrison, then Arthur.

For pure quality in racing at the international level I would rank them Arthur (ranked 15th in world in 1992 in half marathon in 62.15) and awesome Ekiden relay performances on world beating team, vitually equalled by Westcott because of his two very high placings in a couple of the world's biggest marathons in the one calendar year in solid times (both 2.13...London and Chicago), plus half marathon ( and 10000m times that have seen him quite high in the world rankings.

Harrison's best performances seem to have been in relatively low-pressure races on Australian shores, although his 5000m times and 10000m times ranked him very highly in the 89-90 period; although his 30th at World Cross in Aukland was brilliant.

Who can forget Arthur's win in the big one, the City to Surf; the last NSW runner to win this race?

On the actual number of national titles won. Harrison has his nose in front of Arthur, with Westcott, still in contention for more (maybe Arthur is as well!).

Three awesome runners and very hard to separate. Of course, Harrison has the record for number of fun run victories (Jeremy Horne is clsoing in on that record very quickly), although Arthur and Westcott have superior records in major, national-class road races in Australia- Arthur still holding course records in some of the big ones.

Having said all of this Jamie, when you were at your best in late 80s, you were bloody awesome

Arms

#11 Long Arms

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 05:43 PM

I would certainly have Youseff Abdi right up there in the top 10 if I had included 1500m, but I didn't (see top)...it is for 3000m up to marathon (distance running). I also would have definately included Danny Boltz, however virtually all of his top performances were in Swiss colours when he lived offshore (where is he now?)Danny grew up in Sydney and in fact still holds the Marsden High School 1500m school record of 4.10, set on a grass track in a school carnival- Russell Stokes, no.1 podiatrist for runners in Sydney just failed in his attempt to snare thisd record during the Marsden School Carnival of 1987, running 4.12.

#12 LAWRIE WHITTY

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 06:36 PM

Long Arms- Paul Arthur asked me this question a few years back and he was very surprised when I said that I probably wouldn't make the top 10.

Let's not make this too complicated to start with.

Who is Tony Manning?

#13 DrJH

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 09:03 PM

It's very hard comparing runners whose careers overlapped, let alone those who didn't.

John Andrews had virtually two careers, interrupted by 4 or 5 years of injury. Up to about 1983 was when he ran his 28.09 10k, won Zatopek and made the Commonwealth games. Then from about 87 he returned and ran his 5k PB, made the top 10 in the world half marathon, etc. It was during this latter period that I raced against him. On the road there was no comparison - I can't recall any race I beat him in. I remember him handing me a 40 second thrashing in the state 15k road in 88, and also being in front of me in the City to Surf that year and in 89 (4th and 5th).

At cross country I think we only had 3 races. In 88 he beat me in the state 8k at Narrabeen. I was third but I can't remember if he or Quentin Morley won. At 12k I beat him in the state in 89 and also world cross country in 88.

On the track he was 1st to my 2nd in our PB 5k in 89. Two weeks prior to this I beat him by 15 sec over 3k, me 8.04, Dave Lightfoot 8.09, John 8.19. He was in front of me in the Aust 5k in 88. When I won the Aust 10k in 94 John was third. You could probably argue that the 6 year age difference was well and truly in my favour by that time!

With Lloydy there is no comparison, like I reckon it is comparing me to Paul. The ****** is so far in his favour it isn't funny. It was only really my 5k PB race, races when he was coming back after the car accident or when he was on the way down that I beat him.

Like wise with Paul, it was only really in the late 90s after coming back from England that Paul got many wins over me. This included some state 10ks, cross countries and fun runs. In don't think he has ever beaten me in a track race under 10k, including the state 5ks I won in 2000 and 2001. My win loss record over half marathon is better as well. When I won the race in Tokyo it was still a 15k, not a downhill half marathon. I remember him and Jim Gollege in fron of me in the 2nd of the state (Anzac) half marathons. I beat Quentin and him to win the first one the year before. He may have beaten me in the SMH versions I was 5th and 4th in, in 96 and 97. I know I was second and Paul third in the Aust half at Lake Macquarie in 97 (behind Lee Troop).

Lawrie Whitty is the one I probably had more races with than any of the others (maybe apart from Paul). There were thrashings from both sides as well as some really close ones. I think the results were mixed on the road, Lawrie being more dominant in the mid 80s, me more so in the late 80s. I won the last two state 15ks, in 89 from Lawrie, in 90 from Paul. However, Lawrie had beaten me in most of the state/nationals prior to this (85 to 88). During this time Lawrie also had some solid marathon performances. Half marathons weren't too prevalent prior to the 90s, which also counts against the likes of Dave Power and John Farrington.

Cross country was probably in my favour, Lawrie beating me in state and National in 85, me being the first NSW finisher at nationals from 86 to 89. Track was similar, although my PBs are faster.

David Evans is someone who probably has a better win/loss record over me. Again, the 6 year (exactly) age gap means we didn't race a whole lot. He was second in the world student 5k in 91 (I was in the other heat and missed the final). He is never given enough credit for that run! Then it was really only mid to late 90s that I raced him. When I won the state 5k in 94 he was second, and third to my second in the 1500. He won the 100th state 12k CC, Paul 2nd me 3rd. (I beat Paul the next day at Woodstock, but we were both behind John Wall). In the state 10k road in 97 Kim Gillard won from Paul, Dave then me. In my last state 5k win in 2001 Dave was third. However, in the late 90s, 2000 Dave had a host of good road runs, many of which I was behind him in. My 5 and 10k PBs are faster but he better PBs at 1500 and 3k.

I can't recall any occasion Scott Westcott has beaten me, including Aust CC in 96, an interclub 5k in late 97 and Woodstock in 2000. There have been plenty of races in the last few years he would have beaten me in if I'd been there though!

Most of my good runs were done domestically. This is because I was never given the opportunity to race anywhere else! As someone who concentrated on long track races there were limited chances each season. I've run under 14 min at interclub which probably doesn't rate too highly on the 'Longarms international scale' but you won't see that from too many of your top 10. I won 4 nationals at an olympic distance but was never picked for any teams so I raced in what was available. Going to England for 4 years was done off my own bat and financed by me, as was travelling back briefly in 94 to try and make the commonwealth games (which I obviously didn't).

Back to you Longarms!

#14 Long Arms

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Posted 30 December 2004 - 12:36 AM

Laurie,

Great to hear that you are alive over in Thailand. We were worried you may have been swept away by Tsunami (not Sue Mahoney....another great NSW runner- she came 8th in 1995 Boston in 2.33...then again this is only about guys isn't it????). I hear Tony Manning could run...is he in your top 10 Laurie? By trhe way Laurie, who was the first New South Welshman to break 2.20 in the marathon?

I am a big fan of Dave Evans- he "just" missed the Olympic 10000m qualifier in Vancouver in 1996; placed several times in City to Surf. Awesome effort to gain silver in World Student Games 5000m. Unfortunately he was injury plagued...could have done anything if he had a couple of consistent years of training behind him. If it was just track ratings, then Dave would be up in the top 6 or 7; as you would be Jamie.
So what are all your guys top 10. This has been a good discussion but no more rankings...come on guys...throw in some different top tens...or do you all agree with mine (I doubt it).

Arms

#15 LAWRIE WHITTY

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Posted 30 December 2004 - 01:55 AM

Hello Arms. Bangkok is a long way from the beach. The whole thing tidal wave thing is a bit overwhelming especially when it happens to a place that you have visited.

Tony Manning is in my top 10 especially seeing that not too many of us have a Commonwealth Gold under the pillow.

Rod McKinney was the first Australian to break 2.20,  2.19:06 in Fukuoka the year before Clayton ran 2.09:36  Rod was based at Orange.

More on this top 10 stuff later.

Who ran 4th in the 1962 Comm. Games marathon?

#16 Sparkie

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Posted 30 December 2004 - 12:00 PM

quote:


Who ran 4th in the 1962 Comm. Games marathon?  

Keith Ollerenshaw (another New South Welshman) - 2:24.59.  

For those that aren't aware, Australia came 2nd (Dave Power 2:22.15), 3rd (Rod Bonella 2:24.07) and 4th (above) in this race, won by Brian Kilby of England (2:21.17).

#17 stokesy

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Posted 30 December 2004 - 03:05 PM

Thanks for the plug long arms. Danny Boltz's Marsden High school carnival record was actually 4.05 done a grass track completely alone. With the benefit of having a time to chase I thought I could get it, however a stress fracture put an end to any chance. I did manage 4.02 at the CHS carnival a month or 2 later, although on tartan and with competition. Danny also ran 8.43 for 3000m on the same track (Dunbar oval at Marsfield) and held the CHS record at 8.28. NSW top 10 looks pretty ordinary compared to a Victorian top 10 all time

#18 Long Arms

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Posted 30 December 2004 - 04:51 PM

Stoksey,

I agree that Victorian top 10 is better than NSW top 10. The NSW list is still bloody good though. Plus, if you look at the list of male distance runners who have won medals at the Olympics (the pinnacle as far as I am concerned, NSW has two medallists (Power and Lawrance)and Victoria has two Victoria has one (Landy and Clarke). Having said that, I'm not sure where Edwin Flack came from, although he was residing in England in the period leading up to the Olympics. It could be argued that Elliot was a Victorian, although I will call him a West Australian so that NSW remains equal first in the Olympic distance running medal tally with Victoria! Does anyone know where Edwin Flack came from...may have to put him at the top of the list if from NSW.

Plenty of legends from way back. Apart from those in the top 10, names mentioned ni this thread include Keith Ollerenshaw, Marty Dent, Tony Manning (Commonwealth Gold in steeple....this guy also ran an 8.38 for the steeple on a cinders track in a state championship race in 1970- a great time 34 years ago, especially in a state champs race!), Dave Evans, Rob McDonald, Kim Gillard, Quentin Morley and Rod McKinney. Other legends include J.Hatton, J.Sheaves, N.McDonald and R.Vagg.

Arms

#19 old miler

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Posted 30 December 2004 - 05:06 PM

Flack was a Victorian.... buried in the Berwick Cemetary

#20 Long Arms

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Posted 30 December 2004 - 05:30 PM

ok we will pay that one to the Vics. They top the medal tally

#21 DrJH

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Posted 30 December 2004 - 07:41 PM

It would be interesting to see a 'state of origin' list. Some of our top runners weren't born in NSW. Likewise others would come in (Shaun Creighton). I think Paul Arthur was the first local born runner to win the City to Surf.

The real stats experts will have to work on this one!

#22 ParkRat

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Posted 30 December 2004 - 08:39 PM

Isn't Kim a 'two header' and therefore doesn't qualify?

Speaking of Tasmania, Lawrie's win over Deek in Hobart in 1982 National Cross was impressive considering Deek's form at the time.

#23 Owain Lewes

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Posted 31 December 2004 - 02:44 AM

What about all time club teams?
When I took up running way back in the mid eighties,there were several cracking teams fighting it out for distance running supremacy.
Afew examples:
Sutherland: Steve Poulton,Ian Graves,Peter Hutton,Simmo (Peter Simpson),Greg Hoare,Geoff Bruce.

St George: Lawrie Whitty,Mathew Todd,Steve Nobbs,Brendon Shaw, Louis Young,Mark Vassallo.

Bankstown Sports:Paul Arthur Murray Halls,Bob Prentice,Richie Roberts,Horst Wegner,Steve Montague.

Randwick Botany  : Michael Iverach,Peter Hepworth,Les Good

Reebok (Now known as Sydney Pacific): Jim Golledge,Ken Raupach,Simon Hedger,Dave Forbes,Quinton Morley,Jason Maxwell

Wests : Dave Lightfoot,David Rundle,

NSW Uni : Jamie Harrison,Ian Humphries.

Cumberland Ryde Hornsby : Geoff Berkley,Russell Stokes,Sean Williams.

Notable names that I've omitted rarely competed in NSW events even though they were registered ie Andy LLoyd,Danny Boltz, Colin Dalton reasons being they were based in Canberra.


I'm sure I've missed a few others but maybe some of the older runners can add a few names to a few of the club teams.

#24 don27

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Posted 31 December 2004 - 12:45 PM

Tony Manning would have to fit in the top 10 somewhere 8.38 steeple on cinders & the 1500 interclub record for over 30 years.
Some other notable guys who would not make the top 10 but were very good runners were Dave Lotty, Bobby Vagg, Dennis Nee who won the City to Surf, Bruce Adams,Steve Poulton,Brian Morgan  John Stanley,Yousef Abdi & Holt Hardy (1500) who have not been mentioned.
A lot of talented juniors never made it thru to senior ranks Andrew Reardon & Greg Dunsford come to mind.
The Vics top 10 would be awesome.

#25 superflake

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Posted 31 December 2004 - 01:06 PM

Dave Lotty still holds the 10,000m record for Randwick-Botany harriers at 29:24.6 from 1969.
According to Dave he did this in Japan and is not his fastest time.
Still runs stuff for NSW Orienteering.
I asked him the last time I saw him about 2 months ago about it. He was surprised he still had the record.  B)

#26 Long Arms

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Posted 31 December 2004 - 01:23 PM

Don27,
Dave Lotty, Bobby Vagg, Dennis Nee who won the City to Surf, Bruce Adams,Steve Poulton,Brian Morgan John Stanley,Yousef Abdi & Holt Hardy ....all great runners as well. Youseff has already been mentioned, but falls into middle distance category, as does Holt. Some fine mrathoners in Poulton, Morgan and Stanley. Steve Poulton has to be NSWs most consistent marathoners, if not one of Australia's most consistent- how many sub 2.20 marathoners did he run?
Superflake, it certainly is a long standing club 10km record for Randwick Botany. I missed it by 7 seconds in 1995; Chad Roberts missed it by 14 seconds in 2002. One of the current crop of juniors will surely smash it soon.

Arms

#27 superflake

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Posted 31 December 2004 - 01:56 PM

Don27,
The record for Tony Manning is that the 3:43.1 from 1970?
This time is still the 1500m club record for Randwick-Botany.
Plus he also holds the 5000m club record set in 1970 at 13:55.8.   B)
Edit: sorry, it's on the website. Didn't know it had not been updated.

#28 DrJH

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Posted 31 December 2004 - 04:15 PM

Doesn't Yousef Abdi run for Randwick Botany?

#29 Long Arms

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Posted 31 December 2004 - 04:43 PM

Yes Youseff runs for Randwick Botany. we will have to update records on website as he definately has 1500m record in 3.36

#30 Jonesy

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Posted 31 December 2004 - 10:28 PM

Bit thin on the ground in NSW.  Try some Queenslanders - Pat Carroll, Gerard Barrett, Simon Doyle, Mike Hilliard.

Go the maroons!

#31 Owain Lewes

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Posted 01 January 2005 - 03:54 AM

Long Arms,
Further to your query regarding Danny Boltz: I believe he married Jill Hunter (Former 10 mile record holder) and is now settled in Durham;NE England.
Although I can remember him running for Chester-le-Street;a top club in Northern England,I don't think he was the Boltzy we know of. Having said,Jill Hunter was never the same athlete  (1990 Commonwealth Silver medallist in the 10k behind Liz McColgan) after a leg operation-wedded bliss.

#32 nipper

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Posted 12 January 2005 - 11:44 AM

Alby Thomas is my coach and this may be a bias opinion somewhat but i think he would definatley be my number one. He is a remarkable guy, full of charachter and wisdom and is a dead-set legend who was the greatest in his day.Yousef Abdi i would also say would be in my top 10.

#33 MPT

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Posted 12 January 2005 - 12:11 PM

My top 10;
1: Dave Power
2: Alby Thomas
3: Allan Lawrence
4: Andrew Lloyd
5: Tony Manning
6: John Andrews
7: John Farrington
8: Lawrie Whitty
9: Jamie Harrison
10:Keith Ollerenshaw

Honourable mentions: Danny Boltz, Paul Arthur, Steve Poulton, Rob McDonald

* The reason why DP is above AT is because the criteria is 3000m+. If one included the 1500m/mile then AT would be number one.

** I debated whether to include Shaun Creighton in the list. Raised in Armidale, went to Duval High but I do not remember that he ever ran for NSW. If I did include him he would rank up with Andrew Lloyd.

*** Lawrie Whitty's destruction of Rob de Castella in the 1982 national XC in Hobart(when Deek was at the peak of his ability) is the best domestic distance running performance by a NSW runner I ever saw.

**** I actually raced or did training with 11/14 names on this list !!

#34 pheidippides

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Posted 12 January 2005 - 02:20 PM

what a great walk down memory lane this dicussion has been.I see Murry Halls name mentioned.I remember seeing Murry finnish second to Peter Hutton in an inter club 5k race at Hensley Athletic ,Murry's time I think was 14-33
he was 16 years old at the time.Murry eventualy
unofficially broke the Australian u/20 one hour record,ditance covered 19,007 metres,run at The Crest athletic field in 1982,the same evenyt in which Andrew LLoyd (unofficialy)broke Dave Power's NSW record,Andew's distance 19715 mwtres.

#35 HardnFast

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Posted 12 January 2005 - 08:49 PM

What about Glenn Richie? I think he has PB's something like 800 - 1.48, 1500 - 3.38 and I'm sure sub 30mins for 10K. He also won the state X-country one year by a mile out at the Crest.

#36 Long Arms

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 11:42 AM

Glen Ritchie, in his day strcuk the fear of God in almost every miler in the. For high ranking (ie top 2 or 3) national class performances though, 1500m/mile is where it ended for the Ritch. To run 3.40 for 1500m, which he did, one has to have the strength to win a NSW cross country 8km title on a good day (which he did....great run too!). There's a big differnce between running at that level and being up there winning national titles over long distance events  and being of inertnational class over long distance events like so many names mentioned by so many people in this Thread. The Ritch would have to go close to making a top 10 800m/1500m list.
Great to see he is still battling away these days, well into his 40s, still with that strong body and blond hair. He will have to watch out for the "older" (49 year old) Keith Bateman, who is currently flying...ran 34.31 (pb) for 10km on Saturday and went fairly close to the Ritch over 800m just before Xmas.

Arms

#37 Owain Lewes

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 02:39 AM

Long Arms,
What would your top ten list for 800-1500 metre runners be?
Would that include guys like David Forbes and Adrian White?

#38 don27

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 02:49 PM

Hi Owain & Long Arms,
I hope I don't bore Cool Runners too much this & maybe this should be on a different thread my here is my top 10 NSW Middle Distance Runners.

1. Graham Rootham -  Olympian & National Champion 800m
2. Albie Thomas - Olympian & World 2 mile record  holder & NSW Mile record holder for years
3. Chum Darvall - PCG Champ 800m
4. Youcef Abdi - Commonwealth Games Bronze Medalist 1500m
5.Stan Barwick - National Champ 800m
6.Paul Gilbert - Represented Aussie at World Champs 800m
7.Holt Hardy - Very unlucky not to make Commonwealth Games team ran 1.48  - 800m & 3.38 - 1500m
8.Martin Byron - National placegetter over 800m
9. Glenn Ritchie - Still going strong Natioanl Placegetter 1500m 3.59 Mile PB
=10. David Forbes - Great competitor always gave 100% &  Andrew Lloyd - Had to put him in even though he was a distance runner still ran a 3.39 1500m & perhaps one of the most talented runners I've seen.
Honourbale mention to Andrew Currie,John Wall - unfufilled potential,Colin Dalton - 3.41 PB,David Byrne - 3.41 PB,Jeremy Roff 3.42 PB,Peter Hutton - Great competitor probably has as many state titles as Jamie Harrison,Graeme Cook - naturally gifted 1500m runner, Adrian White - short but fast 1500m career, John Hancock - 800m runner from the 60's,Phil McKnight I think his name was from Parramatta 800m runner whose duals with Chum Darvall at interclub were fantastic.

#39 DrJH

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 03:00 PM

Don't forget Michael Donnelly, State Champion at 800, 1500 and mile, a 4.01 runner who also finished in the top 10 in the City to Surf!

#40 Owain Lewes

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 05:20 PM

Another honnourable mention: Ian Gaudry.
Also Dr JH,what was your 1500 Pb,you couldn't have been too far off some of the guys in the previous thread'd list.
Owain

#41 MPT

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 05:38 PM

Don27,
A great list (from which you modestly excluded yourself !!)
You would have to include Alan Ozolins in any NSW 800m all time list.
I would rate Albie Thomas ahead of Rootham as I think Albie was a relatively better 1500m/miler than Rootham was as an 800m runner. Rootham was never as successful at international level as Albie was.
Other worthy mentions would Tony Manning from RBH, Alan Robinson 3.39 1500m from SYU (1969 i think), Rod McVicar (1.47 for 800m)and Adrian White.

#42 don27

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 05:56 PM

MPT,
You are so right about Alan Ozolins he had great 400m speed as well.Ian Gaudry another South Coast product would go close to making the list. I forgot about Al Robinson 3.39 1500 in the 60's is very impressive .He was racing just before I started running at interclub so had a memory fade & poor old Tony Manning did not make  the original Long Arms top 10 NSW Distance runners list & I forgot him again. I did not include Rob McVicar  800 runner because he ran in Melbourne & Sydney & I wasn't sure whether he was Victorian or New South Welshmen. Adrian White got an honourable mention . Pat Schammell was also from Albury but ran mostly for Victoria.
Thanks for the input it is open for debate.

#43 Long Arms

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 06:29 PM

My Top 10 All Time NSW Middle Distance list is:
1. Alby Thomas (4th fastest mile in history at one point...1958.....equivalent to 3.46 mile these days!)
2. Yousef Abdi (3.36 for 1500m and easily the most sub 3.37, 3.38, 3.39 and 3.40 runs by a New South Welshman...he actually has a slower pb over 400m than don27 so he has awesome sped endurance)
3.Grant Cremer (1.45 for 800m and semi finalist at World Champs and Olympics in the tough modern era- acreer cut short by savage injury- now in athletics admin doing a great job slotting in more evening meets for the distance runners at Homebush, coaching a junior squad and trying to figure out new methods to keep the timetables on schedule at Saturday afternoon meets)
4.Graham Rootham - Olympian & National 800m Champion (got a hat-track- 71, 72 and 73, including 1.46.5 in the final in 1972), plus he won 6 state titles in a row (69, 70, 71, 72, 73, 74). Also won 3 state title in a row over 1500m!
5.Paul Gilbert - Represented Australia at World Champs 800m, pb of 1,45
6.Chum Darvall - PCG Champ 800m, ran well at Edmonton Commonwealth Games, winner of 3 state titles in a row (77, 78, 79)
7.Holt Hardy -  3.38 for 1500m was an awesome performance, plus several other sub 3.40 runs to his name.
8. Martin Byron- 1.46 for 800m: consistent 1.48 man for several seasons. Always a threat in national titles and grand prix races
9.Glenn Ritchie -  National Placegetter 1500m 3.59 Mile PB- tough as nails
10.Andrew Lloyd- more talent than the rest of them put together and as he will tell you now, "I was a 800m/1500m runner who did the wrong thin by running so many fun runs, even marathons, as a youngster"---still ran a 3.39 1500m by WHAT A KICK! Possibly could have broken Aussie 1500m record with differnet upbringing, then again coujld have ended up as a mediocre 3.37 man wihtout a Commonwealth Gold- all hyperthetical.

Did Alan Robinsonfrom SYU run 3.39 for 1500m in 1969? if so then he would be in about 5th spot on my list

Arms

#44 Long Arms

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 06:42 PM

I forgot Alan Ozolins on my list- slot him in about 7th

Arms

#45 MPT

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 06:44 PM

Your right Long arms how could we have forgotten Grant Cremer !! I can only plead onsetting Alzheimer's disease in my midddle age !!

#46 DrJH

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 07:52 PM

Owain, my best is only 3.46. I have beaten Abdi, Gilbert, Hardy, Ritchie, Currie, Forbes, Donnelly, White, Dalton, Cook, Hutton over 1500 though.

David Evans, David Lightfoot, Michael Trinca, Peter Hepworth, Guy Watson also rate mentioning.

Alan Robinson ran 3.41.

#47 Jimboy

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Posted 13 January 2005 - 08:23 PM

Jamie,forbesy must have had an off-day!  :D

#48 Long Arms

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Posted 14 January 2005 - 11:24 AM

MY UPDATED MIDDLE DISTANCE TOP 10: 9HOw did we all forget big Lachy??? I put him in at number 6)
1. Alby Thomas (4th fastest mile in history at one point...1958.....equivalent to 3.46 mile these days!)
2. Yousef Abdi (3.36 for 1500m and easily the most sub 3.37, 3.38, 3.39 and 3.40 runs by a New South Welshman...he actually has a slower pb over 400m than don27 so he has awesome sped endurance)
3.Grant Cremer (1.45 for 800m and semi finalist at World Champs and Olympics in the tough modern era- acreer cut short by savage injury- now in athletics admin doing a great job slotting in more evening meets for the distance runners at Homebush, coaching a junior squad and trying to figure out new methods to keep the timetables on schedule at Saturday afternoon meets)
4.Graham Rootham - Olympian & National 800m Champion (got a hat-track- 71, 72 and 73, including 1.46.5 in the final in 1972), plus he won 6 state titles in a row (69, 70, 71, 72, 73, 74). Also won 3 state title in a row over 1500m!
5.Paul Gilbert - Represented Australia at World Champs 800m, pb of 1,45
6.Lachlan Chisholm- 3.37.0- no.1 in Australia in 2004- just missed Olympics- still young and on the way up *hopefully)
7.Chum Darvall - PCG Champ 800m, ran well at Edmonton Commonwealth Games, winner of 3 state titles in a row (77, 78, 79)
8.Alan Ozolins- a couple of national titles- ran 1.46
9.Holt Hardy - 3.38 for 1500m was an awesome performance, plus several other sub 3.40 runs to his name.
10. Martin Byron- 1.46 for 800m: consistent 1.48 man for several seasons. Always a threat in national titles and grand prix races

#49 plu

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Posted 14 January 2005 - 11:30 AM

quote:


Glen Ritchie, in his day struck the fear of God in almost every miler

and he works hard outside all day up and down the Central Coast.

I speak to Glen every holidays at Avoca about his running and training.  He is still very strong.  Good on you Glen.

Plu (Martin and Jenny of Avoca)

#50 LAWRIE WHITTY

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Posted 14 January 2005 - 06:14 AM

Besides Yousif tell me who has finished higher than 4th in a Comm. Games 800/1500 from NSW in  the last   ? years? And Chum Darvall is No.8?


And who is Ian Gaudry? Hint: Won an Australian title which a few on the top 10 never did.